More on Private Providers

[ftstn]

at one stage in tassie the privateers had oranges, but i understand that a decision was made to allow red n blues under disaster legislation which would allow them to assist in MCI,  the private guys are not allowed to transport emergency cases (as a rule), they have to call AT comms and get a ambulance, we also have two major PTS services ( ambulance tas PTS and Ambulance Private) and a couple of smaller ones ( St Johns and a new mob i cannot remember there name, Ambulance Tas also have a number of First reponder groups as well

[sba]

What level of professional indemnity insurance or qualifications are in place?

But what type of services are popping up?  bearing in mind event organisers want St Johns type rates (volunteer services small $$ charged). SAAS are correctly overpriced as part of cost recovery for having a professional Emerg service on standby.

If this provider pictured is licensed and ticks all the governance boxes then I will eat my hat (liabilty/indemnity insurance alone is more than the cost of the Ford Ambulance pictured).

Numpty it's not as hard as everyone thinks.

[sba]

Rumour is St Johns are moving away from the higher risk events due to whole of organisation risk. Could just be rumour (happy for SJA to correct that statement if not correct).

.

As for the Gillman event medical provider, along with any other private provider - I suggest that people explore what Professional Indemnity and public liability insurances are held along with the integrity of the providers equipment, clinical governance framework and pharmacological scheduling / licensing and management... (just to list a few considerations)... St John recently (4 - 6 months ago) published an internal memo regarding private providers to its membership regarding its existing members whom might wish to work for them... It wasn't creating a negative slant but rather attempting to assist members to make an informed choice / decision...

Cheers
Shane

Shane based on the memo, are you loosing volunteers and work to other not for profit and private companies?

[sba]

Heard from a mate in Victoria that the Ambulance Victoria PTS contract from 2013 is up for grabs. National  Patient Transport and Medical Transport Services current share the contract for all AV PTS  jobs. Interesting to note that St. Johns and RFDS are in the tender pool for the AV 2013 contract.

Nice little money earner for either not for profit organization if they win it.

[Numpty2012]

No chance of either getting into AV. . One doesn't have the capability or funds required. The latter you may find just purchased a mob called AMT (www.amtser.com.au) who work for private hospitals running Toyota hiaces with single PTS cert iii.   I've heard of one private hospital AMT contract where they charge $16 per transport between facilities !!!! (it is that cut throat amongst privates trying to get private marketshare .. why even bother)

NPT and GSL have well over 200 Ambulances between them. To put it in context SAAS has 234.

GSL (MTS) is owned by a global entity worth in the billions and I suspect have many friends in Federal and State government to support a further contract.

Unless SJA and RFDS can find 200 ambulances (circa $18m-$22m) and recruit a few hundred plus staff there is no point as the market there is already well serviced.

AV doesn't want to deal with multiple players or run risk of unsettling a stable system under the two large contractors. From all accounts the two contractors are working quite nicely and everything is cozy over in Vic.

[sba]

Never say never Numpty.

[kellyp]

Re Victoria Private Services.

It would be big news in Victoria if MTS, NPT, St Johns or RFDS has bought or taken over Advance Medical Transport AMT (www.amtser.com.au). AMT is currently doing bits of AV work and is not known for their attention to detail, ie staffing. They current work out of the Epworth Private hospital charging a ridiculous low fee (to quote: We'll do what it takes to keep this contract). You forget there is two other companies in Victoria presently doing AV work. Outfits known as Health Select and Total Patient Transports (TPT) two very distasteful lots currently do some work for AV and would will quickly fold if they lost it. TPT has secured the Austin Hospital and all it relative area's from MTS under some wonky deal which would read more like nepotism. (Numpty you may be right about the $16.00 trips).

AV is currently seeking outfits to do their work BUT are also outfitting new PTS ambulance which means that they are slowly taking back the work they lost when it was privatised. Of course AV will never ever have total control when you have the likes of MTS and NPT (and don't forget Paramedic Services a long standing AV contractor)doing AV work. Rumour has it that NEPT providers will be doing most code 2 (with possible use of L&S) and Code 3 work, freeing up AV for exclusive emerg calls. Remember the privates are fully equipped to do everything AV can do, plus.

[kellyp]

Numpty2012 is spot on with the sale of Advance to RFDS. There are three major players in Victoria and they are NPT, G4S (formerly MTS) and Paramedic Services these companies always had the AV contracts. Another player is Health Select with reportedly 20 vehicles.
St Johns are already part of the AV displan loop as is Red Cross.
SBA, St Johns do not have hundreds of vehicles sitting around. They are first aid trainers and do event work. They may have a couple of new Mader built vehicles in the country (state government money ie displan) and lots of older vehicles but they are not equipped to operate large volumes per AV. Yes they pay RN's to attend events (which is unfair to the volunteers)and have some very well trained doctors and paramedics volunteers as well.

We shall all wait and see because the AV contract/s will not be awarded until next year and only after the state government has made some subtle changes in legislation in favour of AV (again).

Regards

Kelly

[sba]

SJA Victoria has 1300+ adult volunteers to recruit from. In addition they now run a commercial unit of FTE and casual staff (they have a contract to supply medics to Vic Rail stations ect.)

You will note they are now teaching/training in certificate II, III (non emergency transport), IV (health care ambulance).
http://training.gov.au/Organisation/Details/70876a96-d2a5-4c9e-bdf4-5a5c35ee72d3

Check out their latest annual report and you will note they have purchased their trial NEPT vehicle, obviously getting ready for something?
http://www.stjohnvic.com.au/you-about-annual-reports.asp

[kellyp]

Hi all,

Medical Transport Services in Victoria are fully changing their identification to 'G4'.
RFDS still hasn't released information to what they will be doing with the former (currently owned) Advanced Medical Transport. AMT staff members are in limbo wondering!

St John Ambulance is limbering up becoming a player (they have an advantage as they are covered under a grandfather clause to use ambulance in the short term BUT they would need to change their name if they are going to operate under the NEPT regulations because in Victoria one is not allowed to use the term ambulance.
So SBA is spot on again though I cannot find anything in the St J annual report.

Regards

Kelly

[sba]

Meanwhile in NSW

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/ambulance-trial-a-mates-job/story-e6freuy9-1226326524370

[excelcare]

So it looks like anyone with $1,500-$2000 to buy a 1980's Ford Ambulance can set up without an Ambulance licence or regulation. Who looks after clinical governance? Who authorises controlled substances (if they use any at all)? What level of professional indemnity insurance or qualifications are in place?

How did this Ford Ambulance gain SA registered plates (pictured) to allow it to be driven on road when the fitting of a red light that flashes is a breach of Road Traffic Act in SA and by virtue of fitting these lights automatically renders the vehicle as non-compliant with registration, Act and regs. (or were they fitted after registration?).

When is the government going to start addressing first aid & event providers "holding out" as something they are not. If it looks like an Ambulance then it darn well is an Ambulance and therefore needs to be treated as such including all the oversight and regulation.

Gillman Speedway is extremely high risk stuff.  Only a matter of time before the preverbial hits the fan. Unfortunately someone's kid is going to be the test subject.

Rumour is St Johns are moving away from the higher risk events due to whole of organisation risk. Could just be rumour (happy for SJA to correct that statement if not correct).

But what type of services are popping up?  bearing in mind event organisers want St Johns type rates (volunteer services small $$ charged). SAAS are correctly overpriced as part of cost recovery for having a professional Emerg service on standby.

If this provider pictured is licensed and ticks all the governance boxes then I will eat my hat (liabilty/indemnity insurance alone is more than the cost of the Ford Ambulance pictured).

Numpty the vehicle in question is a mid to late 1990's Ford Longreach ex country ambulance that did not do service with SAAS but a SA Country independant service.

[kellyp]

Meanwhile in NSW

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/ambulance-trial-a-mates-job/story-e6freuy9-1226326524370

Good spotting SBA....