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Author Topic: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber  (Read 30014 times)

Offline bajdas

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SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« on: April 27, 2009, 06:07:43 PM »
From: http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/story/0,22606,25385931-2682,00.html

SA watches trial of giant waterbomber

A GIANT 747 air tanker that carries eight times as much water as other firefighting aircraft and moves twice as fast is bound for Australia.

The "Supertanker" will undergo its first fire season test in the US this year and authorities from SA, Victoria and NSW will be watching.

US officials have discussed the aircraft with Australian agencies, including Victoria's Country Fire Authority. Manufacturer Evergreen Aviation plans to stage a demonstration in Australia.

The plane is a Boeing 747 modified to carry 75,868 litres of water - more than eight times the usual payload for waterbombers.

It can reach speeds of 965km/h, twice as fast as typical firefighting aircraft, and disperses water with the same pressure as driving rain, the manufacturer claims. It takes about 30 minutes to refuel and refill using high-speed pumps.

The most effective airborne firefighting weapon used in Australia is the Erickson Air-Crane Helitanker, such as the one nicknamed Elvis, which is brought from the US each fire season.

The chopper carries 9000 litres of water, but it takes just 40 seconds to refill by lowering its bucket into a local water source
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Andrew Macmichael
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Offline RescueHazmat

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2009, 06:11:02 PM »
I hope it can't "mass-deluge".. - 70 thousand ton of water coming down on the 'ground' crews, won't be fun!
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Offline Pipster

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2009, 07:08:30 PM »
Great..it carries 75,000 litres of water.

In summer, with a lack of water supplies, where is it going to fill?

Does it scoop from the sea?   I can't see it being able to scoop from any other water supply in SA in summer....

Perhaps the Govt could just give the money they were going to spend on this project, to CFS, for new stations etc....it'd be more effective!

Pip
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Offline Zippy

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2009, 07:30:55 PM »
Can it fly from Queensland when it floods...
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rescue5271

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2009, 08:32:21 PM »
I think you will find it wont be using WATER,but THERMO GEL as that is what the USA is using in it at the moment..But lets face it where will it land and how much will it cost to run?? I can't see it doing any work outside of a capital city unless they are going to make country run ways longer....Nothing wrong with what we have in place now,but its ok to Look but lets get it right sure go see what its all about come back and rather than sit in the city and say yes it would work have some workshops and get volunteers to have their say...

I can tell you already what I would say.....
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Offline adelaide_medic

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2009, 12:44:12 AM »
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Offline chook

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2009, 07:06:07 AM »
Now you know where your budgets go - junkets :evil:
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Offline RescueHazmat

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2009, 07:11:08 PM »
Quote from: Pipster on April 27, 2009, 07:08:30 PM
Great..it carries 75,000 litres of water.

In summer, with a lack of water supplies, where is it going to fill?

Does it scoop from the sea?   I can't see it being able to scoop from any other water supply in SA in summer....

Perhaps the Govt could just give the money they were going to spend on this project, to CFS, for new stations etc....it'd be more effective!

Pip
They have said it will have to fill with water/fuel from an airport. - 30 mins turn around with their pump systems.
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Offline firegun

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2009, 09:00:33 PM »
This sounds good, let us get one for next year. :-D

Then as it will only be able to be used from Adelaide, that is OK too.
This will then allow the current "crop" of aircraft we contract each summer to be dispersed across the state to supplement the rural firefighting capacity.
Wait a minute, where is the money going to come from, from the current "air" budget, or from one of the other "buckets" the CFS has.
(i am being sarcastic tonight, its been one of those days) :wink: :wink:

I am sure that the CFS powers that be would weigh up all the options before committing to such an arrangement.
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Offline TillerMan

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2009, 10:00:00 AM »
What a joke if they even think about it, haha it makes me laugh.

As for gel, that would cost a fortune...
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Offline 6739264

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2009, 10:21:49 AM »
I would love to see it try to scoop from the sea, only to promptly tear itself apart and find itself featured on next weeks episode "Air Crash Investigation"

Well hey, why not purchase one? I mean, if we can spend the entire SACFS RCR training budget on ASPHALT, we may as well spend some of Euan's paycheck on this shitheap of a fuckup.
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Offline jaff

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2009, 11:19:56 AM »
Everyone is getting caught up in arguements over trivial things, as a Fire service I think we need to rise above petty arguements - costings, bombing agents, turn around times and aircraft effectivness to name a few.
For me the one critical issue that still has not been clarified is, will it have a siren?
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Offline 6739264

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2009, 11:31:25 AM »
Quote from: jaff on April 29, 2009, 11:19:56 AM
For me the one critical issue that still has not been clarified is, will it have a siren?

They come fitted with two Federal-Q Mechanical Sirens. I believe they also have a H2 Covert Siren Controller with Wail, Yelp, Hi-Lo, Hyper-Lo, Hyper-Yelp, Whoop, Manual Wail and E-Air Horn options.

Rumour has suggested a MX 7000 Lightbar...
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Offline bittenyakka

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2009, 07:42:38 PM »
Well i would love to see how well it works, But have my doubts along the lines of impractical :-D
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Offline Alan J

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2009, 11:49:25 PM »
Comes with 4 Pratt & Whitney sirens. 
Two settings only - "Wail" and "make-the-ground-shake".

Seeing as it can only operate from long paved runways, we can look forward to significant upgrades to Cherry Gardens airstrip...  blow more than just the
training budget on asphalt !!  :-D

BRING IT ON !!!!
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Alan J.
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Offline boss

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #15 on: June 30, 2009, 07:15:26 PM »
the sa govament should get three of the and use them for ki all three should knock the fire's out in next to no time no more strike teams for us firey's     :-P :-D
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Offline vsteve01

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #16 on: July 01, 2009, 04:32:40 PM »
something like this seems more appropriate
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDa0gs6c6FU
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Offline crashndash

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #17 on: July 01, 2009, 09:06:06 PM »
nope...it's not

our reservoirs dont have the north south clearance for them to fill.....and east west is limited by cross wind on bad fire days with wind from the north (so they pick up less water).

Cant fill from the ocean in sea states over 2....so waves more than 0.75m....which is most days

Designed for use in the Great Lakes area of US and Canada....for there its fine
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Offline boredmatrix

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #18 on: July 02, 2009, 04:02:24 PM »
Quote from: 6739264 on April 29, 2009, 10:21:49 AM
I would love to see it try to scoop from the sea, only to promptly tear itself apart


nah..that wouldn't happen...unless it's an airbus!!
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rescue5271

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #19 on: July 02, 2009, 08:45:14 PM »
The supper scoopers have been used here in Victoria as part of a tour that they did back in late 1990's and from that report it was found back then that we dont have the vast lakes and water ways that they have in the USA and so they would be limited in there use here.

Hey let them go and watch but lets face it, it will only work close to a major city  and even then you will have problems trying to get a time slot to land at a AIRPORT....
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Offline CFS_Firey

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #20 on: July 04, 2009, 05:27:26 PM »
Quote from: bajdas on April 27, 2009, 06:07:43 PM
The most effective airborne firefighting weapon used in Australia is the Erickson Air-Crane Helitanker, such as the one nicknamed Elvis, which is brought from the US each fire season.

How can they make a claim like that?  Perhaps they meant most expensive?
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Offline Alex

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #21 on: July 04, 2009, 07:52:53 PM »
hmmm most effective/pretty looking for spot fires perhaps....
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Offline Alan J

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #22 on: July 05, 2009, 07:51:25 PM »
Quote from: CFS_Firey on July 04, 2009, 05:27:26 PM
Quote from: bajdas on April 27, 2009, 06:07:43 PM
The most effective airborne firefighting weapon used in Australia is the Erickson Air-Crane Helitanker, such as the one nicknamed Elvis, which is brought from the US each fire season.

How can they make a claim like that?  Perhaps they meant most expensive?


I can think of two possible views on this.

One is: It was a quote in the paper from last year.  So it must be true.

Two is: The most effective equipment is the stuff that offers politicians & other
        clowns the most photo opportunities.  Isn't it ?

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Alan J.
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Offline CFS_Firey

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #23 on: July 05, 2009, 10:49:38 PM »
Quote from: Alan J on July 05, 2009, 07:51:25 PM
Quote from: CFS_Firey on July 04, 2009, 05:27:26 PM
Quote from: bajdas on April 27, 2009, 06:07:43 PM
The most effective airborne firefighting weapon used in Australia is the Erickson Air-Crane Helitanker, such as the one nicknamed Elvis, which is brought from the US each fire season.

How can they make a claim like that?  Perhaps they meant most expensive?


I can think of two possible views on this.

One is: It was a quote in the paper from last year.  So it must be true.

Two is: The most effective equipment is the stuff that offers politicians & other
        clowns the most photo opportunities.  Isn't it ?



I'm going for option two.
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Offline Firey_Al

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Re: SA watches trial of giant waterbomber
« Reply #24 on: October 11, 2009, 11:20:25 PM »
 :mrgreen: More Air Tractors thank you Mr CFS People..... Love to see those yellow ducks fly..... Do a awsome job at fires... Cheap and very cost affective...  :-P More Air Tractors means more jobs as well...

Stuff using Super Bombers like the 707 and 747 types they use in the States and parts of Canada.... Too costly.... Too slow.... Too dangerous.....

My thoughts only...
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