Author Topic: Violence on scene (Read 21317 times)

jaff · « **on:** April 27, 2008, 01:11:11 AM »

You often see on the paging network, response for ambo,s with the warning possible violence on scene,is this a a common occurence at the scene ?
What safety measures do you have in place ?
Your job would be stressfull enough as it is, without this distraction!!

Cheers Jaff

RescueHazmat · « **Reply #1 on:** April 27, 2008, 05:02:15 PM »

This is a warning (one of a few Hazard warnings) which once the criteria is met, the warning is attached.. - It is a warning to the crew responding that what ever they are going to, is either a result of violence, or could have an offender still on scene (or both).. It will result in Police also being notified, and depending on the situation, could result in the crew waiting for SAPOL to arrive before they enter the scene.

adelaide_medic · « **Reply #2 on:** April 27, 2008, 05:11:29 PM »

Violence at a scene as stated before can involve a variety of things. Comms try and give us as much warning as possible taking into consideration what the caller has stated about the case.
Often if crews have attended the same house address and have found a hazard it is logged in the database and stored until another call comes from the same house. Often if violence or an offender is involved we will wait for SAPOL to arrive and enter with them or we may R/V with them at a nearby location to plan how we will approach the house.
As you mentioned, these type of hazards are an unwanted distraction but with society these days it will just get worse i believe.

boredmatrix · « **Reply #3 on:** April 27, 2008, 06:17:55 PM »

safety measures?

.......being street smart. and thats about it.

..having said that....Street Smart is not something that's learned overnight or in some course.......so it really depends on the individual - and how comfortable they are dealing with tools that might be aggressive. end of the day - if you're not comfortable....don't go in.

No-one will be bagged/caned or disciplined for looking after number one (- even tho the media might disagree - isn't that what we're paid for...to put our lives on the line??!

)

more often than not the abuse we get is just verbal....but since wearing blue i've noted an increase in times where we've been mistaken for coppers.....but usually only by the PFO's!

we do have Maglites - but it looks a tad strange (not to mention pre-emptive) carrying one in the middle of the day!

Zippy · « **Reply #4 on:** April 28, 2008, 07:50:02 AM »

04:09:43 28-04-08 MFS: *CFSRES INC006 28/04/08 04:08,RESPOND To,GUMERACHA CFS,GUMERACHA MAP 0 0 0 TG098,ASSIT HOSPITAL STAFF URGENTLY WITH VIOLE,NT PATIENT,GUMA00

04:12:03 28-04-08 MFS: RE INC 006 PROCEDE WITH CAUTION, DETAILS AS PER ALERTS CALL. SAPOL AWARE NO ETA

hmmm, whats everyones thoughts? since we dont know the details might leave out presumptions.

RescueHazmat · « **Reply #5 on:** April 28, 2008, 12:14:16 PM »

Are Gumeracha a new CFS Riot squad?

safireservice · « **Reply #6 on:** April 28, 2008, 12:35:33 PM »

Quote from: RescueHazmat on April 28, 2008, 12:14:16 PM

Are Gumeracha a new CFS Riot squad?

Hmmm. Not really a fire service job. Paid or volunteer, unless there was a threat to set fire to the building.

Cameron Yelland · « **Reply #7 on:** April 28, 2008, 12:44:18 PM »

Assuming they were called to help subdue the patient....what a load of crock!

What would happen if one of them was hurt?

But as most things there is probaly a whole different side to the pager message.....well we can only hope!

RescueHazmat · « **Reply #8 on:** April 28, 2008, 01:07:48 PM »

I agree with both of the above. - But as you said Cameron, I guess we will have to wait till we hear the full story.

adelaide_medic · « **Reply #9 on:** April 28, 2008, 03:41:06 PM »

If your not sure how to handle the case or your not trained...i would wait for SAPOL to arrive. Services need to perform to their scope of practice and not step outside that. You dont see SAPOL fighting fires, you dont see CFS doing the job of SAAS....each service should stick to what they are trained/permitted to do.

Pipster · « **Reply #10 on:** April 28, 2008, 05:25:32 PM »

While not knowing anything about the Gumeracha job, but knowing the area, and the police resources, I'd suggest that CFS were called because there was either one solo officer working, and needed assistance, OR there were no local police on, and realistically, it is around a half hour response from the surrounding areas.....in the meantime, should the nursing staff just wait, with their safety perhaps at major risk, for the half an hour, before the police arrive?

Adelaide medic, while I understand where your comment about services not doing the work of other services, is coming from, in practice it could can't work. If each service ONLY did their core business, it would be to the detriment of the public we serve.

While not wishing to make comment on the specifics of this job at Gumeracha, I suspect there may be more to this job than we know

Pip

RescueHazmat · « **Reply #11 on:** April 28, 2008, 05:34:19 PM »

Security at the Hospital then? More police in those areas?.. Not something Volunteer firefighters should be attendind. (In my opinion)..

uniden · « **Reply #12 on:** April 28, 2008, 06:29:28 PM »

I personally would refuse to ride an appliance to a call that came through with only those details.

Zippy · « **Reply #13 on:** April 28, 2008, 06:36:00 PM »

on a lighter note, police might have there revolvers and capsicum spray, but we do have 64mm dont we?...and foam

CFS_Firey · « **Reply #14 on:** April 28, 2008, 06:43:21 PM »

Quote from: uniden on April 28, 2008, 06:29:28 PM

I personally would refuse to ride an appliance to a call that came through with only those details.

What if you had an ALERTS call preceding it - like they clearly did?

adelaide_medic · « **Reply #15 on:** April 28, 2008, 07:05:27 PM »

Quote from: uniden on April 28, 2008, 06:29:28 PM

I personally would refuse to ride an appliance to a call that came through with only those details.

I personally would not be surprised if a unit/brigade would refuse to even respond. CFS dont have the training to deal with aggressive offenders, they dont have the experience nor the equipment. Questions would definitaley be asked if anything did happen to the crew.

Reading the posts on this forum so far the consensus would definiately be that CFS should not be asked to respond to these types of incidents. What next...snake catching?

uniden · « **Reply #16 on:** April 28, 2008, 07:09:34 PM »

As i dont know what the alerts call was about I cant comment on it. My post is based purely on the pager message.

CFS_Firey · « **Reply #17 on:** April 28, 2008, 07:24:32 PM »

Quote from: uniden on April 28, 2008, 07:09:34 PM

As i dont know what the alerts call was about I cant comment on it. My post is based purely on the pager message.

Fair enough.

Bagyassfirey · « **Reply #18 on:** April 28, 2008, 07:33:21 PM »

ive been to baxter detention centre for crowd control in C.F.S capacity. i know thats different but its another angle. as long as the person needing to be controlled wasnt armed why not go?? just my thoughts

chook · « **Reply #19 on:** April 28, 2008, 08:14:35 PM »

If you are not trained in crowd control or dealing with violent persons (like SAPOL are) & you are injured CFS is in breach of the OHS&W Act Section 19 -simple!
If you use excessive force & the person is injured you can be charged with assault - simple!
And you can be sued. Read ths Fire and emergency services Act, this type of activity does not come under your area of responsibility.
Unless of course it involves fire or hazardous materials, you are leaving yourself wide open to all soughts of problems.
As a manager of an Emergency service unit, if we got that page I would want the state duty officers authorisation in writing by fax before a vehicle left the shed - sorry hospital people but having spent time in the military & being taught all of the rules surrounding this type of activity & being a professional OHS specialist & finally seeing how public servants can dodge any culpability,I would not want my people or my own arse being kicked when it all goes pearshaped!
cheers

Bagyassfirey · « **Reply #20 on:** April 28, 2008, 08:23:45 PM »

i guess everyone has their own feelings but like some one else said we don know the circumstances...but i reckon if it happen in our town and our police officer was not in town id be goin 4 sure

chook · « **Reply #21 on:** April 28, 2008, 08:28:17 PM »

Good on you mate, maybe I'm getting too old & cynical:-D
just be very careful!
cheers

Bagyassfirey · « **Reply #22 on:** April 28, 2008, 08:31:09 PM »

some one gotta be old n clynical if they weren we wuld all be out there gung ho doin all sorts..guess it raises the question whatever happen to gettint here doin job n goin home..all gettin to political and way to professional for volunteers.

chook · « **Reply #23 on:** April 28, 2008, 08:45:23 PM »

yep you are right and it is sad that the world we live in has turned this way!
But that is the way its is - don't worry I have thought the same thing. Anyway take it easy!
cheers

boredmatrix · « **Reply #24 on:** April 28, 2008, 11:35:52 PM »

Quote from: adelaide_medic on April 28, 2008, 07:05:27 PM

What next...snake catching?

you lot already squirt.....er.....retrieve cats out of trees don't you?!!??