CFS, 7 news 6 pm tonight

[Stefan KIRKMOE]

Having worked in the CFS comcen for 2 years I think the best thing for the CFS and community has been a combined comcen. Really having the two comcens was a big waste of time, at the end of the day we were doing the same job and there were significant delays to the community because we had to phone a building 2 streets away to get responses out. Atleast now if you call "000" (for fire service) you go to the one place. This is a dedicated Communications Centre facility properly set up to handle emergency call receipt and despatch.
It's not a shoe box with two people crammed in there with 500 different people wanting "send this pager msg out, call this person, we need a sig inc, fax the regions, do we have a weather forcast for tomorrow, despatch the bombers and do a bomber notification and don't forget to book the chopper for tomorrow and have on-call staff confirm, oh and we need it done now!" oh and of course in the middle of all this stuff you would get a phone call "can u page timbuck two brigade and put a msg out saying that Fred's having a BBQ at his house next weekend top celebrate his tractor is running again"....
SOC was understaff, outdated (has anyone requested a GRN/Phone recording be pulled for the old system from a busy day?) Yes I've seen the place SHUT DOWN in a power failure so HQ have been able to do nothing for 15 minutes!!!, the OCO's are overworked and underpaid!!!
Atleast now they are doing the pure job they are being paid to do and that's call receipt and despatch. It now means we have MORE people to answer emergency calls, a reduced response time, a better system for "upgrading incidents" and a level of accountability on the end of the phone. YES there are inssues, I will not sweep that under the carpet but with any change you do have problems to iron out and that's the stage we (CFS in general) are at now. Just because something doesn't work in ur favour one day it doesn't mean the system is crap and won't work. I think as Volunteers we need to support the change as it is FOR THE GREATER GOOD! This is not a "rushed" move it has been on the cards since I left CFS in 2005... Maybe we (volunteers) could make life easier on comms operators by doing simple things, ie. If you need an info msg put out on pagers, call the 1800 number for link, that's what we are paying them for! Also why do brigades need their pagers and sirens set off on training night by comms? Have u seen how many msgs they have to send out on a monday night? Why can't someone at station just push the manual response button instead of wasteing the time for a phone call and the operators time to send the page out... then operators may have more time to do things like answer calls and listen out for the radio!

Just my own views of ranting and raving of a person who believes the system will work having been there and understanding it given some time and education...

[Stefan KIRKMOE]

1927320 20:08:22 30-07-07 MFS: TEST PAGE ONLY 30/07/2007 8:08:12 PM 
1908870 19:53:44 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG (brigade) RESPOND (incident type),(location)test only 30/07/2007 7:54:04 PM
1908873 19:53:42 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG (brigade) RESPOND (incident type),(location)test only 30/07/2007 7:54:04 PM 
1919190 19:46:12 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG BURRA TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:46:32 PM
1919193 19:46:11 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG BURRA TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:46:32 PM   
1919109 19:36:31 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG: BRENTWOOD RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:36:52 PM
CFS - Southern Yourke Group
1919110 19:36:29 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG: BRENTWOOD RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:36:52 PM
1919303 19:34:12 30-07-07 MFS: CFSRES: BARMERA RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:34:32 PM
1919304 19:34:10 30-07-07 MFS: CFSRES: BARMERA RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:34:32 PM
1909162 19:33:52 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG: KAPUNDA RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:34:10 PM
CFS - Light Group
1909167 19:33:50 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG: KAPUNDA RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:34:10 PM 
1909187 19:33:41 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG (brigade) RESPOND (incident type), (location),test only 30/07/2007 7:34:00 PM
1909189 19:33:38 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG (brigade) RESPOND (incident type), (location),test only 30/07/2007 7:34:00 PM
1919347 19:33:18 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG: MENINGIE RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:33:38 PM
1919350 19:33:16 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG: MENINGIE RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:33:38 PM
1909187 19:32:22 30-07-07 MFS: *CFSRES: (brigade) RESPOND (incident type), (location), (other info.)URGMSG (brigade) RESPOND (incident type), (location), test only 30/07/2007 7:32:42 PM
1909189 19:32:20 30-07-07 MFS: *CFSRES: (brigade) RESPOND (incident type), (location), (other info.)URGMSG (brigade) RESPOND (incident type), (location), test only 30/07/2007 7:32:42 PM
1909206 19:32:03 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG: HAMLEY BRIDGE RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:32:23 PM
1909202 19:32:03 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG: HAMLEY BRIDGE RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:32:23 PM
1909018 19:31:10 30-07-07 MFS: CFSRES: LENSWOOD RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:31:31 PM
1909019 19:31:09 30-07-07 MFS: CFSRES: LENSWOOD RESPOND TEST ONLY, TEST STREET, TEST TOWN, DO NOT RESPOND TEST ONLY 30/07/2007 7:31:31 PM   
1919074 19:26:01 30-07-07 MFS: TALK GROUP 155
1919074 19:20:59 30-07-07 MFS: DAILY INC. NO. 51 - 30/07/07 19:21,RESPOND COMMERCIAL FIRE,RETALLACK AV,MARLESTON, MAP 129 H 4 ,,FACTORY ALONGSIDE NETBALL COURTS,205 41 451 201 401*CFSRES:
1909187 19:15:44 30-07-07 MFS: DAILY INC. NO. 50 - 30/07/07 19:16,RESPOND DOMESTIC FIRE,7 JUSTINA PL,SURREY DOWNS, MAP 73 B 13 ,,KITCHEN FIRE,311 9519 321*CFSRES:
1909202 19:01:44 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG (brigade) RESPOND (incident type), (location), (other info.) 30/07/2007 7:02:04 PM
1909205 19:01:42 30-07-07 MFS: URGMSG (brigade) RESPOND (incident type), (location), (other info.) 30/07/2007 7:02:04 PM
1909205 19:00:54 30-07-07 MFS: *CFSRES: balklava)test (incident type), (location), (other info.) 30/07/2007 7:01:13 PM
1909202 19:00:54 30-07-07 MFS: *CFSRES: balklava)test (incident type), (location), (other info.) 30/07/2007 7:01:13 PM
1919074 18:59:39 30-07-07 MFS: TALKGROUP 155
1919074 18:55:48 30-07-07 MFS: DAILY INC. NO. 49 - 30/07/07 18:56,RESPOND COMMERCIAL FIRE,AUDLEY ST,WOODVILLE NORTH, MAP 92 N 15 ,,,205 41 361 243 249*CFSRES:



Now that's in just over an hour... think about if either of those commercial fires had been greater alarm or the house fire had been going or it had maybe just been operationally busy!
And in fairness half the time a radio talkgroup may be turned down is because we all banter on about crap on GRN. "Jimmy can u go down to Billy the Goose's house and see if his tractor has a spare battery on it because he's not home and the truck needs a new battery to start and maybe while ur there call Joan and see if she can man the radio room" and conversations like that usually occur on talkgroup 111 & 124... and I wouldn't think it's funny because things like that are quite common, we are our own worst enemies!

[pumprescue]

Stefan well said...

I think the CFS volunteers would get a rude shock if they had to operate under a proper CAD system and short precise radio transmissions like other states.

Every new thing has issues, if some of you spent more time trying to assist in fixing them then having a good cry on the net the CFS would be a better place.

[SA Firey]

The other night at training. One station was trying to reach Adelaide Fire on 124, they tried several times and eventually gave up I think. There seemed to be nobody home on 124. :S

The lights on but nobodys home

[Red Truck Wonderland]

Well said stefan,
all too often on this forum, it seems that some people have nothiing better to do with their life except, tune in to the scanner, eye the paging system and create rumors. 
I'd also like to add that unless the pager/response error directly concerns you or your brigade, keep you fingers off the keyboard and shut the (hmm cant write that word) up.  sure ask a question about it.
Don't try to put a puzzle together unless you have all the peices.

No matter what is said, a person will only ever make the correct decision at the time.  cause if they knew it was wrong they wouldn't make it.. although in hindsight they may have been able to make a better one.   These guys in com cens do a great job,
Even with the old ERS7 system we had, trucks were sent the wrong way due to communication breakdowns.  To be professional you don't need to be paid.

Please remember they work only with the information avaliable.

lets be positive and not bash the messengers.

This is the 2nd posting for this messsage but think it was worth it.

[SA Firey]

Would also be good for brigades to send their own paging as well.On the old FACU/ERS system you tested it in house so why bother the Commcen with all this pager testing.

Fire season isnt here yet so imagine the workload on Commcen when it hits the fan.

As has been stated there are 9 channels being monitored at MFS and idle chit chat isnt helping....no wonder they take their headsets off

[Zippy]

My brigade used to do HQ to Station paging to simply test the Siren and Doors through the paging system, on a month basis...but at the time of changing to MFS comcen we changed to doin in house testing through airsource.

[Pipster]

I think it is important to test that the ALERTS phone system actually works, and gets through to the CRD centre.

My brigade has picked up faults in our ALERTS system on several occasions, through ringing the fire number, and getting through to the Comcen...

We now test mostly from our computer, but every so often, we want to make sure that the phone system actually still works.  (We are only 25 km from Adelaide, and still on Copper!!)

Pip

[mengcfs]

Yes, you need to test the complete system every now and then. Our Brigade found that the first test on the first day of the Adelaide Fire amalgamation didn't work - Adelaide Fire were not on line. Have since found out from CFS Comms coordinator that it was a problem throughout our Region. It was fixed within a day but if we didn't test the whole system we wouldn't have found the fault. Have had no problems with the system since or Adelaide Fire ever. keep up the good work.

[bajdas]

Noticed that the length of pager messages have shrunk. So the fixes are beginning to be applied.

[Pixie]

MFS: INC # 10 - 01/08/07 05:26,RESPOND Vehicle Accident,COMMERCIAL RD,PORT NOARLUNGA SOUTH, MAP 195 H 3 ,,NORTH OF CLIFF AVE,8334 439*CFSRES:

Looks heaps better!!

now just to move the cfsres: tagline to the front of the page to help reduce the chances of corruption... and the time/date to the end...

[CFS_Firey]

Looks heaps better!!

now just to move the cfsres: tagline to the front of the page to help reduce the chances of corruption... and the time/date to the end...

Negative! I don't want *CFSRES: wasting my time at the begginning of the message.  But by all means shift the date and time to the end.

[bajdas]

I can confirm previous posting by another person (conversation with third person) that meetings have been held for removal of the numeric codes within the pager messages. This includes SES codes changing to letters.

I think this will take a while though, because organisations are taking to opportunity to resolve some long standing naming issues.

[Zippy]

Another Fix applied recent and tested was the separation of brigades within the Onkaparinga Group CFS/SES.

Instead of all the SES taskings being sent to Lobethal..Woodside, Oakbank/Balhannah and Lenswood now have SES codes.

Im "For" *CFSRES being at the front of the message...for various reasons other than pagers goin Tone 7.

[bittenyakka]

We don't need any clutter at the start of the briagd all that is needed is
(brigade name) (incident type) (location) (other brigades responded) x/x/xx xx:xx CFSRES

Now i understand "MFS:" is fixed it sort of is a good way of saying this is a callout even if the rest of the message is corrupt. Whether short names or numbers are used to tell about other brigades I don't mind

[mengcfs]

There were two newsletters on the CFS website yesterday (i downloaded and printed them) in relation to the problems, fixes and priorities of fixing problems. i had a look for them today and the have been removed from the site. The Brigade short names is a proority and being worked on now. Some 18 of the 35 problems reported have been rectified.

[CFS_Firey]

We don't need any clutter at the start of the briagd all that is needed is
(brigade name) (incident type) (location) (other brigades responded) x/x/xx xx:xx CFSRES

Now i understand "MFS:" is fixed it sort of is a good way of saying this is a callout even if the rest of the message is corrupt. Whether short names or numbers are used to tell about other brigades I don't mind

Why do you need the brigade name at the begginning - don't you already know what brigade you're with?

[Pipster]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again...many people within brigades have Group pagers...so they get the whole Groups response messages...having a name at the start tells you straight away if it is your own brigade that the call is for, or for another brigade elsewhere in your Group...

If it is a message for your own brigade, it assists in knowing who else has been sent - eg if you have a report of a structure fire, the brigade names in the pager message will indicate who else is coming...and this is particularly important at the moment, with the problems coming out of CRD transition...

It may be that you know that the other brigade who has also been paged struggles with daytime crew, so you can request another brigade also be paged from the start, not after waiting 10 minutes to find the other brigade can't get a crew......

Pip

[bittenyakka]

I know people who respond to 2 brigades on 1 pager and have arrived at a station at strange hours to find that they are the only person to respond.

[pumprescue]

Ummm, if you got a group pager, make allowances, or don't have one, how is it my problem that you have a group pager, from when I get out of bed, it takes 2 button pushes and I know whats going on.

Another point, think about the liability the commcen has, Captcom was mentioning smoke sighting etc etc, the commcen has a responsibilty to the public, who is to say it isn't a fire, they WILL send the response out, what you do from there is your responsibility.....ALSO like Stefan said, STOP chatting on the regional TG, you have VHF, you have local TG's, if your station is open, why are you on the regional TG, region 6 has got to be the worst for it, get off the regional TG, no wonder they get fed up in comms, let get our stuff together.

If you want to hear how its done properly, get onto an online scanner and listen to the Victorians, thats how its done, no woffle, they only run 4 TG's statewide, and the commcen doesn't take any grief, they will tell you to get to the point.

IF we kept brigade involvement in 000 calls, then we are going backwards, CAD won't work like that, thank god its coming to an end !

[Firefrog]

PumpRescue - Good Post!

You have helped me see things from a different point of view....

[Pipster]

I gather from your post pumpresuce that you live in an area that has street names & street numbers....where it is easy for people who don't know the area, who travel through it, with their mobile phone, and call through what they perceive to be an incident...

My area, less than 25 km from Adeladie does not have street numbers, and can go several kilometres before coming across a street sign...and has lots of city people travelling through with their mobile phones.  They call 000 for an incident...and have no idea where they are.

This has resulted, on several occasions, in a wild goose chase for a number of brigades - or significant delays in getting crews to an incident, because the incorrect location was given by the caller - and those taking the call don't have the local knowledge of the area, so they can only go with the info they get from the caller....

To have a brigade 4 minutes drive from an incident not being responded, but two brigades 15 minutes and 20 minutes drive away were responded is not helpful.

While the SACAD system may help fix some of this type of thing. I doubt it will solve everything - and certainly not in the more rural areas....local input is still important.

And I fear that SACAD is being sold as another GRN - it will fix every problem we ever encounter in relation to CRD, (including which service / unit / brigade should be dispatched) as well as solving the issues of people calling for help, who don't know where they are....

SACAD may be better than what we have now, but I don't think it can live up to its hype....

Pip

[Zippy]

Something to sort out location issues may be an improvement of mobile phone tracking technology...being able to roughly pin point where a call to 000 was dialed initally from.   With 3G and beyond, becoming the norm...surely this is quite possible to create.

The Lot number's system used in the Hill's is Useless....and can only be determined IF at the local station there is a Council Map of the Area with all the Lot Numbers written on the blocks.  Further promotion of Rapid Plates is what the government should be promoting.   and of course...teaching the property owner to remember the correct digits of the plate (at least written on the phone)...

[SA Firey]

Once again who was it that went and provided the RAPID number scheme to the residents in rural areas....CFS!!!

The government has'nt really pushed for it to become standard or compulsory and I agree lot numbers are useless as it does'nt pinpoint WHERE on the road they are exactly.

[Pipster]

And very few people in my area actually display their Lot number (or even know what it is!!)

The locals are pretty good - giving Rapid numbers & the name of the property owner to us via ALERTS....problem is people not from the area, who don't know what Rapid numbers actually are......!

And every other state now, I think, has gone to a new Rural property identification system, known as Geographic information property street addressing, except SA who has only just started it..... it will give rural properties a street number, based on distances along roadways, and not be based on grid refs, lot numbers etc....

Once this system comes into being, it might solve some problems of where people are....

I don't know when it is due to be finished in SA....

Pip