Washup from statewide talkgroup plan

[littlejohn]

It is my understanding that Adelaide Fire is not going to act as a group base for R1, or at least monitor & coordinate resources to the extent that CFS SOCC used to.

I am told (and set me right if I've been mislead) that many R1 groups do/did not open a group base for most incidents, however I would assume that if Adelaide Fire is not going to fulfil that role, many groups are now having to establish Comms or Ops/Support brigades to handle the resource tracking & radio traffic plus logisitics etc during an incident.

Is anyone from that part of the world aware of whether or not there are actually going to be any changes to the way your groups operate this fire season?

[SA Firey]

All you will do is notify Adelaide Fire that you are mobile to incident number XX and the go to your own groups talkgroup and wait for a station to come up on air.If none have done so by the time you arrive then go back to 124 and give a sitrep.Traversing outside your group response area you now go to TG123,and this is also the channel that will be used when going on strike teams.I dont have a copy of the new SOP as yet but this is the context of it.

[Darius]

as the SOP says it is a priority for groups to ensure radio comms is established under local arrangements, all sitreps and information should be coordinated locally.  So yes there is more of a push to either promptly get a station open or for the group duty officer to take comms in the early stages.  I don't see a big problem for incidents where multiple brigades are responded (3 or more) as the chances are good a station will open for comms, the problem will be for single (or perhaps dual) brigade responses during the day (when short of people) then really it will be left to the group duty officer to handle comms.

[Darius]

Traversing outside your group response area you now go to TG123,and this is also the channel that will be used when going on strike teams.I dont have a copy of the new SOP as yet but this is the context of it.

no 123 is not mentioned in there, don't know where you are getting that from (123 is a R1 incident TG).

[mengcfs]

There is nothing in the SOP that states what 'travel' talkgroup we should be using. The SOP states the acknowledgement of page, appliance mobile talkgroups (exixting Regional talkgroups) also known as CRD talkgroups and management and IMT talkgroups. All Captains should have the new SOP by now. Speak to them to clarify. I got mine this week.

[Zippy]

For Region 1 its...Alerts to Acknowledge, 124 to mobile, Local TG to wait for a Station to open, Return to 124 *briefly* to log a sitrep, then return the Local Talkgroup of the incident.   Simple as that.

So at anytime....only Adelaide Fire & the Queue to actually Talk to Adelaide Fire should be on 124...everyone else...on there Incident TG's.

[SA Firey]

Traversing outside your group response area you now go to TG123,and this is also the channel that will be used when going on strike teams.I dont have a copy of the new SOP as yet but this is the context of it.

no 123 is not mentioned in there, don't know where you are getting that from (123 is a R1 incident TG).

Better still wait till YOUR group officers have a meeting with you all and they will tell you the same...so that is where they will tell you about TG123...there are another 50 members of my group, including Euan Ferguson who was present at the meeting at Kangarilla last Monday to back what ive said up



No wonder this forum is going to the dogs

[rescue5271]

Little john,you are correct and its about time that group bases where manned but then again they do it their way and we do it our way...... OHHHHH wiat till summer gets here then what will happen,go to this then to that and now go back to this.....

[alphaone]

Why have the Group Base open up to do comms for every job???

Make sure there is someone at your station to do comms. If that means running with four members on the truck, instead of the five that turned up, then so be it.

I really dont see the need to get Adelaide fire, Group Base, Region HQ, or whoever, to do comms when the stations are perfectly cappable of having comms run from there. Thats why we have the occurence books people.

BTW, I am in a brigade that regularly runs with four people on a truck so that someone can stay back and do comms. And the person who useually stays back is me, and thats by choice.

[bittenyakka]

i agree with alphaone just get a few more operational support members in your brigade and when you et responded they go to their station. if it is a big job then open a group base, IMT, ect.

Or take Mawson group if the station who is the group base took all comms for every job they would be almost living there if they aren't already.

[Zippy]

i agree.   SOP has been to open local Station for Comm's for anything less than a IMT required incident.

[chook]

Thats the way we work. Call up on B001 to advise Adelaide fire on task then swap to unit talk group (except Adelaide Metro). However there is a plan to change to our regional talkgroup for all taskings. If we can't man comms we run the comms log from the incident, not perfect but it works (cuts down on transmissions too ). For normal day to day taskings region is not involved unless invited.
If other units are called in to assist,they swap to the lead units channel. If there is a need there are spare channels to utilise & there is always simplex(for traffic control for example).
Cheers

[Zippy]

i think these procedures as of nov 2007...are pretty much SOP from SHQ days right...so nothings changed

[bittenyakka]

yeah they are just pushing the point that MFS don;t want to be taking comms for everyone as on some days it can get very busy and 000 calls may not be answered as fast as they could be.

[rescue5271]

The reason to open group bases is so that CFS can remove stations that have GRN radio's,all comms should go via the group base,works well in other regions and this would also provide cfs with more GRN radios to put into new appliances. I think you will find this was one of the out comes from a study done by someone up the ladder...Why should each brigade have a GRN base when the group base would be better used if it was manned. This system works well here in the southeast where the group base will open for all call outs no matter how small or big it is,it also gives the group base the chance to page another brigade rather than have the brigade send aout MORE CREW NEEDED 5 times before they ask for another brigade to be paged......

[24pumper]

This system works well here in the southeast where the group base will open for all call outs no matter how small or big it is,

Perhaps would you like to man our group base the 900+ times a year that our group has calls? And there are other groups in similar boat. In times of declining volunteer numbers and increased things to pack into our days is this a big ask of group base operators/ members of brigade that house the local base?? I agree it may work in your and other groups situations who are a bit more quiet callwise but not everywhere.

[RescueHazmat]

Yeah I agree with 24Pumper. - That sounds like a ridiculous system Blinky (For busier brigades).. It might work if the group base Station is the one doing all the calls, but the groups that do 1000+ calls a year, which the group base might do 300-400 of those, think of all the calls (600+) they have to open the base for when they may be 4 brigades "away" from attending!!

Why should each station have a GRN?.. Well, that speaks for itself!.. - I will personally page you at 2am for the Bin fire we will attend if you like and you can do Comms. - No difference to waking you up than the person who would have to go to the group base (3 stations away) to run our comms.

[rescue5271]

As I keep saying what works here and up north does not work in region one,why who knows ok so your group base would do 900 calls do you have OPS BRIGADE's who could mann the group base??? have you looked at just having members  who no longer want to fight fires but may want to mann the group base..As far as I know fire stations here in the southeast have never done their own radio traffic its gone via the group base or group duty officer..someone can correct me if I am wrong.

[Zippy]

Groups do have Incident Management Teams for Higher Alarm incidents...mostly 3rd/4th Alarm incidents...while Group bases are handy for multiple incident management,   my station pretty much utilises the spare responding members (who did not make the truck) to do Radio comm's.


Example
If you have 14 members respond to a RCR,  put 12 on two (6 per) appliances and the spare two can do Comm's pretty much immediately.

Private Alarm:   6 Responding, 3 BA operators,  A Driver, 3 BA ops with 1 FF on the truck....1 on station comm's.

[littlejohn]

By the sounds of it, very little is really going to change, despite the notion of an SOP.

Clearly R1 has vastly different capabilities to say R5.
(eg we don't have grn radios in brigade stations, only group bases, and very few brigades have surplus crew to leave behind anyway. 24Pumper makes a good point about some R1 groups getting 900 calls a year.)

So why continue to maintain the pretence of a statewide SOP?
It seems (from this end of the state anyway!) that R1 by and large has much different requirements of Adelaide Fire than R5 (and probably all other regions too).

I hope the resources have been provided at Adelaide fire to service the fire season.

[6739264]

If the group base opened for *every* job in many R1 Groups, then your Ops. Brigades would be doing 1000+ jobs a year easy.

[safireservice]

As far as I know fire stations here in the southeast have never done their own radio traffic its gone via the group base or group duty officer..someone can correct me if I am wrong.

Or the Comms captain that rushes out to every job and puts stops on the appliances instead of manning the group base?