rope rescue equipment

[oz fire]

And when did CFS have verticle instructors??

To the best of my knowledge the original verticle training to some CFS brigades was by SES, then other have used a private provider - who, of course wil only promote the system they use - i.e. twin line.

Seach the net and you will see O/S where there are specialist teams for verticle resuce, who undertake many resuces each year, that use single line resuce. Twin line in SA has been introduced by a private provider and through their association with MFS.

[bajdas]

So with a single rope system, what's the third point of contact?

I will take the bait now 

First the disclaimer, I am not currently accredited in Vertical Rescue so some of the information could be 'out of date'....

But, the single rope is the least point of failure in the system. If you are completing a rescue litter rescue, then you use a climbing rope of greater diameter than a single person rescue (I think 13mm or above).

This rope has a huge breaking strain of approx 5 tonne. (Blue water ropes). The prussic lines, slings, knots in the Weston rig have less capacity and thus more of a concern.

So within SES we trust the rope implicitly because it is checked, logged and re-checked. Multi-point anchors are used whenever available.

So the three-points of contact for the rescuer are attachment to stretcher, attachment to rope above stretcher knots (via chest & waist harness) and physical to cliff (last one is dubious).

Other methods used by CFS in vertical rescue are banned within SES (eg seat belt devices delivered with rescue litters are not used. Each casualty is lashed into the stretcher at all times).

Has I stated before, lets agree to disagree until a multi-service standard is issued. But SES have done vertical rescue training for 30+ years that I have been associated with them.....


EDIT: Changed the link so it wouldn't make the page too wide

[CFS_Firey]

Ok, I see your point, and won't argue further, except to clear up a few points (replying to various posts):

The purpose of the 2 rope system in CFS is to duplicate everything, not just the rope (So if the crabs do fail, there is a backup)... We're not particularly worried about the rope either...

The third point of contact can't really be reliant on the other (ie if the rope fails, you lose 2 of your points). The same goes for the 2 feet on the cliff being counted as 2 points). However as someone said, its only a guide and can't be practically achieved all the time...

The CFS does not use the seatbelts on the stokes litter for cliff rescue - we use tapes to lash the person in as well... The seatbelts are used when carrying a patient on horizontal surfaces (Like patient lift for SAAS).

Finally, saying that over seas services only use 1 rope means nothing... After all, the SES does many rescues a year, and only uses one rope, and I'm still arguing with them! (Not to mention some of the things the US fire depts do that we wouldn't dream of doing, even though they're an overseas service that does many fires a year)...

When I did my RR course a couple of years ago, the instructor said the SES was looking into moving to a main and belay system.... I take it this wasn't ever mentioned to the volunteers?

[2090]

Well, as CFS_Firey suggested, you still cant see past your rope. Its the duplication of the system to allow for any (no matter how rare) incident of a part of the system breaking. Nothing*should* break as, yes its checked, logged, etc etc, but if it does, I like having my arse covered.