SAAS Responding Other Services..

[sesroadcrashrescue]

16:27:52   15-02-08   MFS: *CFSRES INC044 15/02/08 16:26,RESPOND Vehicle Accident,KAPUNDA CFS,KAPUNDA DISTRICT MAP 0 0 0 TG100,SINGLE VEHICLE ROLLOVER.AT THE FORD,ANGELBY RD.NIL INJURIES.FROM KAPUNDA,CAPTAIN,KAPD00 CFS Light Group Response

saas responded on radio and no rescue responded

[mack]

as i replied in the other thread SESRCR - why bother, i see you missed out on a call, but if Kapunda Captain is on scene saying its a spill only...

[chook]

So Mack, next time I arrive on a job & no risk of fire I put in a stop call on fire response?
Tried that once Adelaide fire would not accept it - we have done many "Spill only" jobs.
You guys whinge when other services don't follow procedures, but you guys just do your own thing!
But it would be nice if RESCUE made the decision to respond or not. See Murray Bridge SES when they get a job, pager message - UM or deputy contact comms, makes the decision to respond or not based on info supplied -if not required Stop call sent via pager. Professional & by the book
Anyway who cares? I don't because we do things properly around here
cheers

[mack]

So Mack, next time I arrive on a job & no risk of fire I put in a stop call on fire response?
Tried that once Adelaide fire would not accept it - we have done many "Spill only" jobs.
You guys whinge when other services don't follow procedures, but you guys just do your own thing!

Your missing the point Chook, if there is an officer on scene reporting the incident, telling Adelaide Fire there is no entrapment then i see no reason to respond rescue.

Re; fire coverage, go for it... not my problem. Id rather get stop called than get all the way out to an incident that didnt require our attendance... I guess it just depends on whether you deem it safe.

I think your trying to stir up an SES Vs CFS/MFS arguement with the wrong person here mate? [if thats what your trying to do???]

[chook]

No not at all Rescue should have been contacted, told the situation & given the choice to respond at a low priority or don't respond.
Given the same situation I would make an assessment on the info & decide not to respond.
Trouble with one service making those decisions on behalf of another service is that occasionally they get it wrong. And these type discussions start 
I'm quite sure the Kapunda captain is a competent & Honourable person.
Sadly there has been occasions where others are not.
And on the subject of stopping a fire response, I don't I just let them know  a P1 response isn't required and let them make their own decision.
Anyway as I said previously personally I don't care, just the protocols are in place for a reason and they should be followed - otherwise get rid of the protocols
Anyway cheers Mack

[mack]

Trouble with one service making those decisions on behalf of another service is that occasionally they get it wrong. And these type discussions start 

and on there head be it

[chook]

Too true

[sesroadcrashrescue]

what dose it say in the RCR directory the service receiving the call WILL respond fire,sapol,saas and first rescue regardless of the incident status. the officer on scene does not understand RCR and has no intension of trying to. and to top it of the car was in a creek and the tow truck just managed to retrieve the car 

[chook]

Mate your wasting your time
It appears rules are meant to be broken.
I would save my breath & get your boss to to a grievance report (East region is averaging 8 a week)
Its a pointless exercise talking about it on here - hopefully our service will get enough filtereds one day to sought it all out for good
Maybe after we have all of the meetings we were promised
cheers

[6739264]

I'm sorry I must have missed it. Where is the protocol dictating that EVERY vehicle accident MUST have Police, Fire, Ambulance AND Rescue responded?

I was under the impression that Rescue was called if there was the possibility of an entrapment, be it either the caller is unsure or confirms there is an entrapment.

If I came across an accident, called it in, "Spill only, all persons out of vehicle, etc etc" and then had the local rescue boys come whipping around the corner, I would be the one putting in a grievance form.

[sesroadcrashrescue]

there is a paragraph in the RCR directory that talks about standards of response.

also had the R2 cfs commander ask me last night why my unit had been defaulting to nuri so much in the last six months. i siad that we hadn't been defaulting. he asked why Nuri were getting so many jobs close to kapunda i siadi i didnt know but we havent been getting responded to RCR in our area he is looking in to it as far as i know   

[chook]

Apparently the issues with "not being responded" are being dealt with at the highest levels.
If future funding of our units will be based on numbers of responses per year & some other stuff, then"the operator pushed the wrong button" will have a dramatic impact.
It is interesting that a CFS commander is even interested unless they are fishing for dirt
Anyway mate I've been told its "being dealt with".
Not much point saying too much more about it publically though
cheers

[sesroadcrashrescue]

yeah no worries i guess he was interested in it from CFS view anyways lets see what happens

[chook]

No worries

[6739264]

SESRCR, go and get your head read mate. The job you're crying about was not a rescue job and 'First Rescue' has no reason to be responded. As has been suggested before, would you like to be responded to every single little vehicle accident? If you really do, maybe you need something better to do with your time.

I know about the standards of response that relate to a 'Rescue' Incident. A vehicle accident with no-one trapped is most certainly NOT a rescue incident.

[pumprescue]

You SES guys are kidding aren't you, its in the disptach rules, if there is a fire service officer on scene and he states that there is no entrapment, eg there is no one in the car, then you only need to respond fire cover. What is an SES truck gonna do besides looking, unbeleivable, you guys are a joke !!

As for the Murray Bridge example, if you think thats the way to run things, then thank god I am not covered by SES rescue in any areas I normally drive, how many times do we rock up to jobs when SAPOL have stated no entrapments and, blam, someone trapped.

Actually I would crash in Laura, those SES guys are pretty decent. Thankfully I noramlly deal with Noarlunga SES, there are some gun operators.


Sheesh, and you guys want us to give you respect. I am finding it very hard going from the posts on this site.

[chook]

Pumprescue, a normal overeaction. MurrayBridge also recon the job & they are "gun operators"! And have a read of your own post - you don't trust SAPOL, but we are supposed to trust you? I've seen non rescue firies trying to open doors with a hooligan, no stablisation, no nothin & no reason!
No offence but there are plenty of teams around as good as Laura they just don't bother with competitions
And Fire Service officers do get it wrong!
And I for one am not interested if you take us seriously or not!
And that is not how I read the rules - anyhow who cares?
I certainly don't! As I said previously you guys keep on doing what you are doing as the heads of our three organisations will be soughting out all of this crap.
While I agree in this instance rescue was not required based on the facts, but the priniciples are the same!
Anyway we have moved on, can't you?
be cool

[Zippy]

you don't trust SAPOL, but we are supposed to trust you?

you dont trust anyone 

[uniden]

Simple rule if there is someone still in the car they may be trapped , doesnt matter what anyone says.
Simple rule number 2 if everyone is out of the vehicle then there are obviously no entrapments and therefore there is no requirement for a rescue resource.

The old KISS principle...

[pumprescue]

Thats pretty much how its supposed to work, I like how you put it Uniden.

[boredmatrix]

Simple rule if there is someone still in the car they may be trapped , doesnt matter what anyone says.
Simple rule number 2 if everyone is out of the vehicle then there are obviously no entrapments and therefore there is no requirement for a rescue resource.

The old KISS principle...

yes -but are they trapped with compression?  or just trapped because someone needs to jemmy open a door?  I've done plenty of RCR as a paramedic - with just the jemmy bar that is on every ambulance!

I have never had to wait for rescue to do something - EVER!  In Metro areas - pretty much all MFS light pumps have enough rescue gear! 

 The only time I had an issue with rescue (in country area) was when there was no hydraulic cutters-  Pneumatic gear took AGES (over an hour to cut the side out of a car in a simple T-bone.) - but we and the coppers kicked up a big stink through the proper channels and the appropriate CFS brigade magically recieved hydraulic gear shortly thereafter!

The cynic in me would suggest that anyone making out of context and ill-informed comments about how things "should" happen - are either new or lacking any credible experience......or just have a jack up their a r s e because they haven't been accepted to MFS after applying 46 times...............

[chook]

Sorry Matrix can't let that go - Never applied for MFS & have no wish to, have had plenty of credible experience both good & bad!
For example watched your blokes drag a rather large, elderly gentleman over a centre consol. No medical reason (not going into arrest or anything) just couldn't be bothered waiting for rescue which was less than 5 minutes away (they were informed of this). Couldn't get the RHS Door open (T-Boned).
As I said previously firies (non rescue) trying to open a door with a hooligan, car unstable, possible spinal.
Roof folded down on to a PT's head so far that his airway couldn't be be cleared properly & a Holmatro set that wouldn't start - need I go on!
I for one never joined the service to do RCR, don't really care who does what, don't have a jack up my filtered about the Mets.
All I have said all along is there is a process that has been developed over a number of years that needs to be followed. And if you and your mates choose not to follow it so be it! When it all goes pear shaped - Who cares as it won't be me or my contempories explaining why!
By the way the guys from your lot up here don't share your views
And on that happy note bye - bye for now cheers

[mack]

farkin AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaayyyy.....



 

[Bowforce]

Actually I would crash in Laura, those SES guys are pretty decent.

Good luck to you.....From what I have seen and heard......

[6739264]

Next prang I get into, regardless of whose area its in, I'm just going to scream for the blokes to give me the gear and I'll cut myself out.

Makes things nice and simple!