BA Re-Accreditation - Vale

[crashndash]

Anyone else get a nice letter from STC about BA reaccreditation? Seems that in response to no money for training, we are now moving away from a 5 yearly reminder of how to wear a set correctly and the correct way to search, do start up drills, and all those other non important things we use to do on BA course.

Instead....a quick checklist run at your Brigade and a Brigade drill and alls good with the world - got to love the world of economical fire-fighting.

[6739264]

Wearing BA isn't hard. The whole BA course that the CFS run is basically a "How do I wore Airset? 101". You are doing your 3 monthly wears arent you?

I think its a great idea, provided that they use the time and money they save for pushing more people through the CFBT course, and perhaps actually getting the Tac Vent course off the ground.

Or maybe just scrap the specialist courses, and ensure that we continue to teach the basics... We are still missing all the information that used to be taught on L3.

[Alex]

Nice in terms of not wasting vollunteers time, but i doubt it will be conducted properly by brigades.

[Darren]

I just hope the time and money is put into initial courses of which the service is sorely lacking in BA operators, otherwise there won't be a need for re-accred's anyway !

[Pipster]

If instructors aren't running around having to do reacreds, it might free them, AND the facilities at STC, up for more BA courses...?

Pip

[Alan J]

I'd like to think so, but somehow doubt it.
More likely that, since "all areas" of the PS have been told to "find savings",
CABA reaccreds have simply been.... cut.
So far we've heard of cuts to nursing, education, justice & roads. Has been real
quiet about emergency services so far...
cheers

[Darren]

I am sure there is some shocks to come....or maybe not such a shock....

[Alex]

quiet about emergency services so far...

quiet??? i already heard a rumor one of the services was being cut %40???

[BundyBear]

The new CABA accreditation is a re validation for a start. The reason this process is being piloted is it to make it easier for volunteers to keep their accreditation current.

Your brigade has a legal compliance to make sure it is done correctly and that it is not a tick and flick process.

The initial course does teach you to wear BA and the search and rescue procedures, all of this which can be practiced at brigade or group level exercises. At the end of the day how hard is it to don, start up, wear your PPE correctly, doff and recomission your set.

Maybe Pipster has a point if this can be done locally maybe the STC can have more time for full BA courses and other courses. The full-time training staff seem to be one department of the CFS that strives to implement changes for the better, learn from operational outcomes and look for opportunities for improvement. They constantly assess other fire services training departments in Australia and in some cases overseas for opportunities for improvement. Examples they brought CFB to South Australia not the MFS, are the leaders in the state for improving URAR you just need to look at the changes made in ten years that they lead with. Are excellent at providing HAZMAT training.

If you've got any ideas let the guys know up the hill as they're pretty passionate about their jobs, I would not get out of bed for the pay and the hours they pull and all of them started out as vollies!

[Darren]

Yeah the lack of courses isn't their fault. But my god they sure give you the run around when you try and do a course...

[crashndash]

The new CABA accreditation is a re validation for a start. The reason this process is being piloted is it to make it easier for volunteers to keep their accreditation current.

Your brigade has a legal compliance to make sure it is done correctly and that it is not a tick and flick process.

The initial course does teach you to wear BA and the search and rescue procedures, all of this which can be practiced at brigade or group level exercises. At the end of the day how hard is it to don, start up, wear your PPE correctly, doff and recomission your set.

 

its nothing to do with making it better for the Vollies...it's about making it cheaper for the CFS. What you have now is a function that is a training (and certification) process, run by people who are not necessarily trainers. Again, just cos Joe Blow your Brigade Officer says you did it right, wont hold up in OHS court.....

One of the main reasons in CFS having a reaccreditation course at all was to get people back in centrally, to ensure that little Brigade-isms didnt creep into peoples practices. Now, there wont be one standard anymore....just a whole bunch of local interpretations of the FGP (like that doesnt happen already..lol)

For those people who are supposedly attacking the Government about training funding......where are u on this? Just cos NZ did it (who have no money either!!), doesnt make it a right and just process.

I'm sorry is that silence I hear the CFSVA or whatever they are this week, making waves in the media about a loss of training funding? Are the gang of 4  GOs(or 5 or 6 or however many there are) going to get in the media about it? Rainer....where are you and Mike Pearce on this?

Of course life is simpler if we as firefighters always stay in our little Brigades and never have to go out into the big world and be accountable to someone neutral for the way we operate....but please dont use that as a justification for a better system....

[Darren]

All good points crashndash but the system the CFS had wasn't very volly friendly, I have spoken to a number of vols who were not able to make the dates offered for re-accreds due to work or harvest or seeding or whatever. They were all told to bad so sad you are no longer BA, no ifs or buts. I was one of them, couldn't make the dates offered without pulling a sickie...

Most of those people said stuff it, not going to bother to get it back, as they clearly don't care.

Now I know its hard to plan courses etc etc etc, but to be inflexible seems to do more harm than good, we know that CFS has bugger all BA operators now, you would think a bit of forward planning would allow for more people to remain BA. The TAS system should be smart enough to allow for 12 months warning. The last BA co-ordinator at STC allowed you to do it in that year, and was well aware of the limitations of time. I am sure most people can plan forward 12 months to free up some time. I got my re-accred letter 4 weeks before it ran out, so I had no hope.

So yes you might get slight variations of things, but I have been on courses that have had just as wild variations, some downright dangerous (anyone remember South Coast Training Centre)

I applaud CFS for doing this, so we can catch up on the HUGE gaps in BA numbers, it was the only way it was going to happen, even if we had twice the number of trainers. Structure fires aren't going to wait, every day I dread that pager going off and wondering if I will have a crew that are BA trained, I know I have a crew coming, but at least 2 of those have been on the waiting list for 3 years....but they won't touch us until we drop below MINIMUM numbers!

Insanity.

[mengcfs]

Again, just cos Joe Blow your Brigade Officer says you did it right, wont hold up in OHS court.....

If you read the letter correctly it says that a CFS Career Staff Member will be conducting the validation.

[BundyBear]

I guess there are positives and negatives for all changes.

At my brigade we have lads that belong to other fire services and emergency services and wear SCBA on a monthly or weekly basis and see this as a positive as they can quickly and easily stay current on a simple principle of wearing SCBA and these shift workers do not have to waste a weekend with having to go to Brukunga and these lads make up a lot of our day crew for BA and RCR so it's vital to have a system that is flexible.

As for brigade bad habits filtering in this can be managed by following the FGP's and SOP's that are now available on-line and having the guts to intervene when we see safety concerns.

I have to agree with you CRASHNDASH on some issues. I have concerns with some of the smaller brigades that are not exposed to regular decent training and high numbers of incidents that some brigades are. So therefore their knowledge and experience will be lacking so I think we need to see a blend of the old and the new to capture the diversity of the service.

[Subi]

I just hope the time and money is put into initial courses of which the service is sorely lacking in BA operators, otherwise there won't be a need for re-accred's anyway !

Stay tuned, i think you will see all the re-accreds programmed for 2010 will be turned into initials.  STC Will not let this opportunity for extra trainees pass them by

[safireservice]

I just hope the time and money is put into initial courses of which the service is sorely lacking in BA operators, otherwise there won't be a need for re-accred's anyway !

Stay tuned, i think you will see all the re-accreds programmed for 2010 will be turned into initials.  STC Will not let this opportunity for extra trainees pass them by

All or just those after 1st July?

[crashndash]

Again, just cos Joe Blow your Brigade Officer says you did it right, wont hold up in OHS court.....

If you read the letter correctly it says that a CFS Career Staff Member will be conducting the validation.

I think if you read your letter correctly....that is for the duration of the trial. Once the trial has concluded,
 "... any CFS Officer who is a current BA operator or an approved BA Trainer Assessor will be endorsed to validate the procedure

And while we're on it....seems like the process for the end of the trial is agreed and in place......is the trial a Dorothy Dixer and a forgone conclusion?

[rescue5271]

In region 5 two CFS staff( R5TO and R5PO) member will be doing the RE Accreditations for the next year or so its a step forward for the service and one that some will not like but we have to give it ago.

[Subi]

I just hope the time and money is put into initial courses of which the service is sorely lacking in BA operators, otherwise there won't be a need for re-accred's anyway !

Stay tuned, i think you will see all the re-accreds programmed for 2010 will be turned into initials.  STC Will not let this opportunity for extra trainees pass them by

given that is only 3 weeks away I don't think that really matters

All or just those after 1st July?