New BA Course Internal and External

[ltdan]

Ah well I guess the CFS will always remain mediocre..........Hey Rann give us some more money !!!!

Isobel will fix it !!

[fridgemagnet]

Relying on a polly to fix it and the last time a polly fixes something other than an election is when.

[Zippy]

Ok people, Let the Liberals win the next election, cos the next election after that...our demands *can* be met for once...Why?

Her Seat sits smackbang on the same land as some of the highest urban and rural risk area of the CFS.  Wanna keep your seat isobel???

[CFS_Firey]

Ok people, Let the Liberals win the next election, cos the next election after that...our demands *can* be met for once...Why?

Her Seat sits smackbang on the same land as some of the highest urban and rural risk area of the CFS.  Wanna keep your seat isobel???

Sorry, but Heysen is a safe Liberal seat.  We can say peoples houses are going to burn down all we want, she's still going to get back in.

[6739264]

Ok, so back to the topic at hand...

CABA is a vital item of PPE for us as firefighters. If I had my way, it would be part of BFF1. Anyhow, this isn't, or ever will be the case.

Seeing as though the CFS doesn't teach anything related to strucutral firefighting very well at all (CFB is hit and miss, and CFS Tactical Ventilation makes me giggle) and they try to jam bits and pieces into the CABA course and the previous level three course, something does need to change.

What can be done? Not much sadly. With people wanting the already basic courses dumbed down, and complaining about their length, perhaps the current method of teaching is the best?

It would be great to have a CABA course, and then a week long or two weekend "Structure Fire" course, but again that will never happen.

All we can hope is that people operate within their ability on the fireground and that brigades take it upon themselves to attempt to enhance the abilities of their members.

Don't forget we are but the COUNTRY Fire Service... What do we need CABA for?

[whitecloud]

Ok, so back to the topic at hand...

CABA is a vital item of PPE for us as firefighters. If I had my way, it would be part of BFF1. Anyhow, this isn't, or ever will be the case.

Seeing as though the CFS doesn't teach anything related to strucutral firefighting very well at all (CFB is hit and miss, and CFS Tactical Ventilation makes me giggle) and they try to jam bits and pieces into the CABA course and the previous level three course, something does need to change.

What can be done? Not much sadly. With people wanting the already basic courses dumbed down, and complaining about their length, perhaps the current method of teaching is the best?

It would be great to have a CABA course, and then a week long or two weekend "Structure Fire" course, but again that will never happen.

All we can hope is that people operate within their ability on the fireground and that brigades take it upon themselves to attempt to enhance the abilities of their members.

Don't forget we are but the COUNTRY Fire Service... What do we need CABA for?

Hear Hear!

The dumbing down of courses is very much an insult to the ability, and potential the service has as a whole for urban AND rural protection.

Why would you need to differentiate? If you have an issue going anywhere near a fire, perhaps BA is not for you, not some halfarsed attempt at dividing BA. Its the same theory on wearing it, just different firefighting techniques once the PPE is in place (I say this loosely, mind.)

HAZMAT is just as bad. Having been to enough jobs with HAZMAT brigades where the operators understand VERY LITTLE of chemistry, and therefore have donned inappropriate PPE, as well as managed to misread plaques, and waste 24 hours due to not understanding that something was so dilute after a time, dumping TONNES of another substance into it was going to create more issues seems like a problem also.

How about we teach some ADEQUATE materials, and people who don't want the responsibility of acting as a BA operator in full stop putting up hands and wasting positions for those who do.

Requirements need to be seriously reviewed, BA operators should be prepared to wear if the situation requires it, more urban techniques need to be taught THOROUGHLY, as opposed to crammed into CABA and CFB courses, and the operators for HAZMAT need to have at least a basic grasp of chemistry.

[jaff]

Hear Hear!

The dumbing down of courses is very much an insult to the ability, and potential the service has as a whole for urban AND rural protection.

Why would you need to differentiate? If you have an issue going anywhere near a fire, perhaps BA is not for you, not some halfarsed attempt at dividing BA. Its the same theory on wearing it, just different firefighting techniques once the PPE is in place (I say this loosely, mind.)

HAZMAT is just as bad. Having been to enough jobs with HAZMAT brigades where the operators understand VERY LITTLE of chemistry, and therefore have donned inappropriate PPE, as well as managed to misread plaques, and waste 24 hours due to not understanding that something was so dilute after a time, dumping TONNES of another substance into it was going to create more issues seems like a problem also.

How about we teach some ADEQUATE materials, and people who don't want the responsibility of acting as a BA operator in full stop putting up hands and wasting positions for those who do.

Requirements need to be seriously reviewed, BA operators should be prepared to wear if the situation requires it, more urban techniques need to be taught THOROUGHLY, as opposed to crammed into CABA and CFB courses, and the operators for HAZMAT need to have at least a basic grasp of chemistry.

I agree with a little of what you said whitestuff, BUT are you now seriously suggesting that all HAZMAT operators need to have their high school diplomas in chemistry....if so I think you should have paid a little bit more attention in sex ed, not chemistry
You need a red helmet not a purple one.

[Zippy]

the person that all of the CFS rely's on for Chemistry Knowledge is the Technical Advice Co-ordinator...whatever he or she passes on from the "Smarties" aka professors... Is the plan of action we should take.

Remembering its a 2-way information updating system...any changes in the situation...Let the TAC know.

CFS's job as hazmat combatants is to Effect Protective and Remedial Actions. Its nice to know and understand these things...but if we all had 20 hazmat operators with scientific know-how...we would actually spend 20 hours being nerds.  Basic principals of chemistry apply for all of us...but nothing atomic mate...

As for the Hazmat course at present? Its "Satisfactory".

what should be happening?   A Hazmat Incident Management Course.

[whitecloud]

Hear Hear!

The dumbing down of courses is very much an insult to the ability, and potential the service has as a whole for urban AND rural protection.

Why would you need to differentiate? If you have an issue going anywhere near a fire, perhaps BA is not for you, not some halfarsed attempt at dividing BA. Its the same theory on wearing it, just different firefighting techniques once the PPE is in place (I say this loosely, mind.)

HAZMAT is just as bad. Having been to enough jobs with HAZMAT brigades where the operators understand VERY LITTLE of chemistry, and therefore have donned inappropriate PPE, as well as managed to misread plaques, and waste 24 hours due to not understanding that something was so dilute after a time, dumping TONNES of another substance into it was going to create more issues seems like a problem also.

How about we teach some ADEQUATE materials, and people who don't want the responsibility of acting as a BA operator in full stop putting up hands and wasting positions for those who do.

Requirements need to be seriously reviewed, BA operators should be prepared to wear if the situation requires it, more urban techniques need to be taught THOROUGHLY, as opposed to crammed into CABA and CFB courses, and the operators for HAZMAT need to have at least a basic grasp of chemistry.

I agree with a little of what you said whitestuff, BUT are you now seriously suggesting that all HAZMAT operators need to have their high school diplomas in chemistry....if so I think you should have paid a little bit more attention in sex ed, not chemistry
You need a red helmet not a purple one.

hi Jaff,

Not by any means am I suggesting that matriculation-standard chemistry needs to be part of the course, but an understanding of what + what = "S**T IN THE AIR OH GOD WHY DID YOU PUT WATER ON THAT, I"M ONLY WEARING A SPLASH SUIT AAGH MY SKIN AND ORGANS!" etc would be helpful.

Perhaps part of the pre course assignment could incorporate some very basic reaction information. Its all well and good to read the plaque, but people walking in with insufficient PPE to incidents which probably require more protective gear and less "Dump disproportionately large amount of quicklime here" would be clever.

Never in my previous post did I suggest it needed to be a high level, that would choke ALL of the fun out of the course...