new level 3 gear (LION)

[strikeathird]

Get ur facts right.

http://users.sa.chariot.net.au/~janinek/photogallery/page7photos/1-mb-Moanahouse-2.jpg



I wasn't specifiying any certain incident, I asked the question if the person was the the one in the photo's from the House fire Down south.....  And I think you will find, the person in the photo has PBI on, and a Flash Hood.

Glad to clear that up.

[strikeathird]

our group officer did recieve honourariums.. and absoloutley none of the firefighters in the group knew...

can you imagine how absoloutely p**sed we were???

not only did they get group cars, which were used for whatever they felt like doing, driving to the shops, taking kids to school, driving to work (for another fire service) and sitting in the car park all day, with free fuel cards, compliments of CFS... but they also had mobile phone bills paid (50% i think)and a few other benefits...

ggrrrrr... not happy.

And thats just wrong, they shouldn't be allowed to get away with that !

[rescue5271]

Was talking to some CFA paid a nd vols the other day and they are not sure what gear they are going to,PBI gold is there first pick but they have had some bad feed back from QLD FIRE RESCUE saying its too hot and crews turn out with jacket off till they get to a working job then put it on. They have found a few problems up there with UV rays and damage to the gear. CFA have a looking at NOMEX or PBI GOLD and each CABA member will get two setts of PBI if they get it.

[kat]

I read even my most mundane posts over several times before posting them to ensure that I haven't inadvertantly said something that could be construed as personal or negative.
I would personally take any accusation of disregard for volunteer safety extremely badly

I have no idea if and when those of us outside the urban fringe will get PBI. We shall continue to use our nomex happily in the meantime. I have never had a problem with the nomex gear in an agressive interior attack situation and it certainly served me well in the extremes of the flashover containers. I would have thought that was as hot an area as I would ever be likely to enter. I don't feel that my safety as a vollie is being compromised if I am not immediately provided the latest market innovation. A Group may have all kind of reasons to choose to stock up on a particular type of PPE and I'd reckon they'd be fully accountable to their Group for that decision.

[kat]

Some Group office bearers may have been in recepit of honorariums and/or reimbursements. These should be transparent in the sense that the Group Managament Committee would have had approved and endorsed these and that they appear in Group Financial records which are audited and public.

A memo was recently released regarding the cessation of honorariums.

Group vehicles should also be transparent in their use and should be utilised for Group Officers to get to incidents, operationally at incidents and secondarily for travel to meetings and trainings. Genuine concerns with any usage outside of CFS reasons should be put to the Group. You may find that genuine usage is being misconceived as abuse.

[oz fire]

Kat - I know the company who were doing sizing were trying to make their way around the state (also some boffins from HQ). I think (actually know) though they may have been bobbed out or R3

[kat]

It is easy to be jealous of Brigades or Groups with the resources, personnel and drive to get out there and do something above the norm. Good luck to them if they can do it - their "proactiveness" has had positive flow on effects for all of us.

Not so long ago Brigades simply did not have what they didn't get for themselves. CFS as an organisation lagged behind what Brigades did for themselves and many of the items that are now standard PPE or stowage were fundraised for, researched, tried, tested and purchased by individual Brigades. Fairly recent examples include structural helmets, 25mm extension lines and variable flow branches. These were pretty basic items that CFS just did not supply or have a standard for.

This really has changed for the better (despite definate shortfalls) since the change of funding to the ESL. CFS is much more up with the times in relation to equipment available (despite what you 2500GPM aerial skyjet wanters may think )We also, as Brigades and Groups, are much more restricted in what we can go out, research and buy for ourselves now in any event. (The flash hood debate being a perfect example).

[kat]

They're not coming to Region 3??

[oz fire]

Well they will be coming, but were bobed out until last as there was a perception by bob that it wasn't a high priority - despite a large number of brigades with large urban risks  Think however that the OH&S drive may change that!

[Wagon 1]

Its not just the urban fringe brigades getting it, its just that we see things like that as important, anyone can buy it at anytime. It just depends what your brigade/group/region see's as important. I am afraid its a simple fact of life that we have more occasions to wear it, and our work load is geared more toward the structural incidents, you can't burn grass and scrub if it isn't there to burn!!! But again its what you see as important, Naracoorte I think went in for it from the word go, correct me if I am wrong.

Ozfire, when bobing around was bobing around khaki overalls were the bee's knee's.

[strikeathird]

Remember a certain strike team deployment.... Where a rather Rural brigade didn't see it as un-canny to wear the jeans and the flanney...


Nothing like knee high boots, TOp Guards, and single piece overalls

[Wagon 1]

But strikeathird, thankfully that very rural brigade had an officer from a very different brigade that put his foot down and threatened to call the IC and have the appliance removed from the fireground, and boy did that go down well, not!! No room for cowboys.

[oz fire]

Saw some photos the other day of an MVA on the Gorge Road, near Athelstone - the RCR crew (identified by their RCR tabards) were ALL in PBI - so I guess when a brigade with numerous staff wear PBI to many varied jobs, it's no wonder the rest of us are confussed.......
I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard for an Executive answer and for either Euan, Brenton K or Malim to write a one page statement and distribute to all brigades - would save all the BS this forum and others have been going on with while the issue remains unresolved

[Wagon 1]

Yeah, you would think they would issue some guidelines before giving the go ahead to order, but as usual we are left to fly blind and have a bunch of different rules made up by brigades and groups, IF CFS HQ ARE READING THIS, GIVE US A FINAL GUIDELINE ON USE AND CALL IT FINAL!!

[strikeathird]

BAHAHA

(All that needs to be said).

[kat]

Its not just the urban fringe brigades getting it, its just that we see things like that as important, anyone can buy it at anytime. It just depends what your brigade/group/region see's as important. I am afraid its a simple fact of life that we have more occasions to wear it

David, I am afraid that the only way my Brigade (in Region 3) knows anything about PBI is because of this forum. We have had no opportunity to decide whether it's "important" or not.

When the last SFEC's were released my Brigade was one of 27 in the state that received an urban rural rating. I'm sure you didn't mean to imply that the urban fringe Brigades are the only ones with risks and who may see firefighter and community safety as important.

[strikeathird]

Kat:  Urban-Rural, or Rural-Urban ??  There is a differance, just wanted to clarify which class it was.

And if you are Urban-Rural, I know alot or Rural-Urban brgades, that are EXTREMELY busy, and should be classed differently, but are not.

And in regards to the PBI Kat, you / members can buy it your selves "if you wish", how ever it is costly.

[Wagon 1]

Ah, Kat, thats where your region is letting you down badly, I have seen some pictures from other brigades in your region fighting a large factory type fire with BA operators in Proban, when I asked a member of this brigade I was told the Nomex was hanging in the station, they didn't know what they where going to!! WTF!!

So I think you need to ask your region what is going on!!

So your Urban/Rural, interesting, has anyone tried getting there standards looked at lately? It seems nobody wants to know about it.

[TillerMan]

Was talking to someone last week from Happy Valley brigade (think he is LT2 or something), he said they are trying to get their SFECs upgraded from rural/urban to urban/rural but region dont think they can justify it??? Dont know if anyones been to Happy Valley lately but its pretty urban if you ask me.

[fire03rescue]

Off the topic but
Good luck with their SFECs upgraded from rural/urban to urban/rural

[Wagon 1]

WTF!! I would have thought Happy Valley were Urban/Rural already!! Your right , apart from the fringes (which look like they could have a decent fire) its pretty urban to me. Tillerman, any reason for the change, looks like they already have a pumper and a 24P, or is that going to change?

CFS do some funny things sometimes.

[TillerMan]

Don't know, will try find out and get back to you. their pumper would be pretty old now i think. They also have a little 14 rodeo

[kat]

We were rated Urban/Rural (don't worry I know the difference) and this was based on the three risk ratings in special, rural and structural threat. These were developed a long time ago using complex formulae and I don't know how much work has been done on them since. Just because there are a lot of urban risks in an area doesn't mean the Brigade will be rated urban/rural - there are other factors involved like proximity of other resources. And when the prescriptions were released with the SFEC document I'm pretty sure there were only 27 - and you would be quite suprised to know who they were, I'm sure.

We have BA Brigades in the Region that do not posess a set of Nomex turnout gear. Group budgets may be accommodating $10 000 photocopiers but basic PPE is still an issue. The thing is who should be monitoring this???

[strikeathird]

I don't know where you are from Kat, but thanks for clearing up the specs Q.  Alot of people do get it mixed up sometimes.

I find it interesting about how the SFEC's and how equipment etc is allocated sometimes.  With all this talk I did some investigating on my afternoon off.. I was going to compare it to Kats brigade, as they are Urban Rural, but don't know which brigade it is .. So after hearing about Happy Valley being Rural Urban, I looked at and found the following info.

Happy Valley: (EMA Brigade) (Attended 252 Incidents last Financial year)

1xDesignated Heavy Pumper (H/V Pumper)
1xUrban/Rural 24P (H/V 24P)
1x14 Appliance (Holden Rodeo Dual cab) (H/V 14)

Response Zones:
Metropolitan - Major City and Suburban areas
Grasslands - Grasslands
Hills & Mountains - Hills & Mountains
Rural Areas - General Rural environments
Bushland & Scrub - Bushland & Scrub
Towns & Urban Areas - Towns & Urban Areas

Carries:
8 x B.A Sets.  - 4 on H/V Pumper, 4 on H/V 24P
PPV Fan
Generator
Port. Pump
Lighting
Foam
Chainsaw
Plus other.

Incident Types (Short List)
Building Fire (29)
Combustible / Flammable leak (4)
Extrication/Rescue(not vehicle) (3)
Flood (7)
Hazardous Material (3)
Grass or Stubble Fire (26)
Mobile Property / Vehicle (21)
Private Alarm (24)
Scrub and Grass Fire (13)
Vehicle Accident / No Injury (17)
Vehicle Accident Rescue (5)
Vehicle Accident With Injuries (18)

I found it interesting.  I looked at a few brigades on the promo site this afternoon. (Above info from promo site).  Now, H/V as well as a few other brigades in the group attend more Vehicle Rescues, and MVA's in general, than some Rescue brigades.  Yet there is no designated "Heavy Rescue" in that group. (As far as I can tell).  There is also no HAZMAT in the group either.  The nearest Rescue brigade for Happy Valley is either MFS (If they are available) or it seems Blackwood (Which is some drive ! ).

Now, I can't see how that is not an Urban / Rural brigade.  As I looked at a number of other brigades on the promo site, which are, and they hardly compare.

Would be interesting to see how to define Urban Rural.  I used to live way out country, so a 24 in the stix was sufficient.  But all your talk on SFEC's got me interested.

Are there any Urban / Rural brigade members on this forum ? (Other than Kat)..  And where are you from ?  Would be intersting to compare.

 

[CFS_Firey]

strikeathird - How do we find out whether our brigade is Urban / Rural?  Is there a copy of the SFEC guidelines on the internet somewhere? (Or even better, a list of each brigades SFEC requirements? )