Recruiting the younger generation.

[6739264]

My brigade, like most around the state is having issues crewing, both generally and during the day time. Many of the older members are wary of trying to actively recruit people in the 16-20 age bracket as they are seen to be moving on quickly, immature, and not worth the training and PPE investment. I don't hold this opinion and see the younger age group as being an untapped resource of enthusiastic people with fresh ideas, as well as having an increased daytime availability. Perhaps even a higher degree of fitness than those older members. People may leave or reduce their input to the brigade once they 'start their life' so to speak, but if you can get 4-5 years decent service out of a person, that is a great thing no?

So are any Brigades/Units actively trying to recruit the younger members of the community? Are there any specific strategies that you have found useful? The fact that CFS (and I assume SES) courses can count towards SACE is a great incentive, but once again its seen by some people in our brigade as being a negative due to people not joining for the 'right' reasons.

[OldOne]

So are any Brigades/Units actively trying to recruit the younger members of the community? Are there any specific strategies that you have found useful? The fact that CFS (and I assume SES) courses can count towards SACE is a great incentive, but once again its seen by some people in our brigade as being a negative due to people not joining for the 'right' reasons.

From a Metro SES view point,  over the last 5 to 8 years we find the 16-17 age group are heavily committed to final year high school studies and their social life is starting to get active at weekends.   The 18 to 21 years groups mostly go to university or if employed go to trade schools, have very little spare time to commit to weekly training programs and are not normally available for daytime crewing either.

The best groups seems to be in the 21 to 28 year age group if they can manage their social activities with SES activities.  The 26 to 35 age group normally do not last long due to the family growing, ending up in middle management at work and finding no spare time at all for regular SES commitments.  Some times you get them back when the family and work settles down and they are looking for something different as a life challenge.

The best target range I have found is the 20 to 26 age group and you will normally have then for 3 to 5 years before life changes happen or aim for the mature over 35 age group.

Arno.

[6739264]

The best target range I have found is the 20 to 26 age group and you will normally have then for 3 to 5 years before life changes happen or aim for the mature over 35 age group.

That sounds like a good target. Perhaps we have been lucky with the High School/Uni course loading and Fire Service related enthusiasm with our younger members leading to a false sense of increased availability. The 20-26 age group you suggest makes a lot of sense.

The other thing that needs to be looked at, at both Brigade level and higher is the length of time it takes people to get onto specialist courses. In an SES unit that had RCR, how long would it generally take before a member off the street could train in RCR?

[bittenyakka]

Well being in that age group I say go for it.

There are a few issues i have noticed
- Sometimes it is hard for younger people to talk in an equal manner to older members, But that is part of life however i would suggest the older members remember this.
-There are some young people who cannot commit to anything that includes their own studies, job, boyfriend /girlfriend, so if they don't stay at CFS don't be surprised.
-We are often at a time in our lives where we are essentially just waiting for an big opportunity to start our careers so we may suddenly leave (more so than older members) this may be through a new job or marriage etc... However don't let this preclude the younger members from taking on positions of responsibility in the brigade, just accept you may have to hold an election halfway through a term.

- Listen to us, Lots of my friends and myself to an extent have grown up i an environment where we are considered equal in terms of opinion/right to talk. Eg I have been told I am wrong in how to do stuff the day after i got back from completing the course on it. So age doesn't mean you can stop learning.


In saying all this i believe young people have alot to add to brigades, But i believe it is very important to have a "probie" period at which the end of the brigade has the easy option to terminate the member.

One strategy for getting young people is simple let the truck roll with a young crew if you can we like being with our own age group.  

[rescue5271]

I am all for the younger members joining we just need to change the generation problems... I like the idea of a mentor system or a buddy system when a new person joins. The other issue i see and hear about is that we still have far too many brigade's(cfs) and units (ses) who wont allow females to join the service.While we still have these members with that attitude you are going to find it hard to get new members while those guys accept that in this day and age that females make very good firefighters and they should be allowed on the fireground and on the appliance.....

Good luck with trying to get the younger guys and girls to join and if you need a hand contact your regional VSO......

[OldOne]

The other issue i see and hear about is that we still have far too many brigade's(cfs) and units (ses) who wont allow females to join the service.

Good luck with trying to get the younger guys and girls to join and if you need a hand contact your regional VSO......

Well "most" SES units have females in the rescue teams and a number also hold senior rank.

If a member, male or female has completed the training course they do the job.  we have females using chainsaws and power tools as they are qualified to do so,  there are also females who are vertical rescue qualified.  there is no discrimination allowed in SES and any female or for that matter male who is discriminated against can report the matter and with a 21 day receive feedback response to the incident if reported in writing.

All emergency services are equal opportunity organisations as decreed by the Government.

Re new members, most units do not have block intakes so a new member in most SES units are paired up with a mentor member until they have done the induction courses.

Arno.

[Pixie]

I fall into the age bracket you are referring to... and i am not entirely convinced that this is the correct age group to be trying to join.

I feel that most,not all, males aged 16-25 are way too full of bravado to be working on a fire ground. it just seems to me that these young guys will always try to "prove" themselves (and how tough they are) by doing irresponsible ,possibly dangerous, things...

By all means there are some great young fireys out there ** cough, cough, yours truly, cough, cough**... but looking at most of the guys i went to school with, I can only think of one other guy from my year that would go well in the service, that is out of around 150 students. and he is now in full time employment, and thinks he cant commit himself enough to join.

I am a BIG BIG BIG fan of cadet programs, no not because i like little children you sicko's!, whereby adolescents in the 13-16 age bracket are introduced to  the service, learn about firefighting, RCR etc. get to work on and around fire appliances, all whilst having fun. although, in saying this, i have heard of some cadet programs that i would not consider appropriate, where it seems all the kids are there for is to have fun, and parents use it like a night time baby sitter.

My opinion only!
Pixie

[bittenyakka]

I half agree with Pixie,

Yes of course pretty much all males especially young bulls will like to prove themselves but.

I would say it is a matter of simply training correctly that it is a Deadly serious occupation and therefore requires some maturity etc. You would be surprised how many young people change there attitudes the moment they change from School to a work environment.

[21337]

like pixie said, there should be cadet programs, I saw on tv about the programs that the cfa have and it was put across the same as scouts, there to have fun but learn at the same time.

[bittenyakka]

well i spent the better part of 4 -5 years in scouts, and then venturers. then i joined CFS when I was 17. Lest just say mall most of the kids did at scouts was piss around, yeah they did learn some stuff and if you got a good group of mates it was fun.

BUT the huge difference and hence appeal when i joined CFS was that instead of learning how to be a good citizen etc you are doing something REAL and in the face of it. Also  you are surrounded by an older age group and hence need to earn respect.

in sating this i have also recently been told apparently the 12-16 age group of guys especially are very loud and often look like they are messing about when they are actually learning.

[OldOne]

like pixie said, there should be cadet programs, I saw on tv about the programs that the cfa have and it was put across the same as scouts, there to have fun but learn at the same time.

That interesting,  SES do have cadet groups at selected units, there are a number of challenges with running cadet units,  Firstly you must have trained and SAPOL cleared officers as you are working with "children", the cadets need access to both male and female approved officers at all times,  and a minor can not be but in any danger during any training and can not be used on operational tasking on a truck until 18 years of age by law,  they are MINORS in the eyes of the law same as scouting and school events.

Trying for 13 to 16 year olds is mostly a wast of time for trainers and students as their school work should be most important thing to gain high marks etc for their future prospects.  But note some people use SES cadets nights as cheep evening child minding centres.

The cadet trainers will have extra commitments in working out weekly safe training programs and attending cadet trainer meetings plus keeping up their own skills on normal training nights.  So unless you have 12+ cadets in a group and can train on a different night it will not work out in the long run as you must comply with Child safety laws and all normal OHS&W requirements.

Arno.

[Robert-Robert34]

Being a CFS volunteer helped me while in high school as i was getting good grades in Community Studies due to my teacher also being a CFS vollie  

[6739264]

Its also interesting to note though, that we have atleast two people posting in this thread that are under 20 and are SFF's in their Brigades.

[OldOne]

Its also interesting to note though, that we have atleast two people posting in this thread that are under 20 and are SFF's in their Brigades.

Yes I agree there are some very keen and active you people in both CFS and SES who excel at all the courses they attend, but they are not the norm but are at the top end of the scale and will probably be the ones that stay for life and end up possibly running the groups in the years to come.

Arno.

[Bagyassfirey]

im only 23 also and tend to agree some of the older memebers don tend to like some of our input at times...i also tend to think that it doesn matter what colour helmet or striped u have whether ur 18 or 60 it all comes down to experience

[rescue5271]

CFA have a very good in schools cadet program that has been running for a number of years and works well,cadets are the future of the service but in rural area's there are less and less young people. The good thing about cadets is that the kids get to learn all about the main brigade and can look forward to coming up to the main brigade in time but also they know that they want to do XYZ course when they do get up there...

[chook]

Numbers to answer your question on RCR normally 6 months, however in some very special units (Barmera for example) you can take two months off that (they have the specialist resources to do what is supposed to be the impossible).
A new member of my old unit joined in july & qualified RCR 2 weeks ago so about 5 - 6 months. Its the general rescue requirement that throws a spanner in the works so to speak. Anyway hope that helps
cheers

[Pipster]

It is possible to mix young & old together successfully.....but the brigade as a whole needs to have the right attitude.  To get the right attitude is something that has to be continually worked at.

I started CFS at 12 & a half.   Even while studying Year 12, and then Uni, I still an active member of the brigade.

As I got a bit older, and took on positions of rank within my brigade, I was keen to recruit younger members who had the right attitude, not just recruiting younger members.

My brigade has recently taken on some cadets aged 13 (boy), 14 (girl) & 14 (boy).   They were selected not so much for their physical age, but more their mental age.    They wanted to come to CFS, not their parents wanting them to come to CFS.

It was made clear to them before joining, what is expected of them, and that they are at the brigade to do CFS activities, not Scout activities.  (if they want to do Scout / Venturers / type stuff then they should go and join Scouts / venturers)  If they join the brigade, then they will be doing firefighting skills.    They all joined CFS, and attend regularly.

In attracting younger people to join, as with any age group, is you have to make them welcome, and feel part of the team.   

In creating a welcoming environment for any person, the team has to have the right attitude.  For anyone, being told what they have just been taught on a course is the wrong way of doing something is generally not going to be very helpful.  Assuming that a young, (or a new) person cannot bring any useful firefighting knowledge, or any other useful info to the brigade is a great way to loose them.

At the risk of sounding like a social worker, I believe the following - to attract and retain members, of any age group, they need to be made to feel welcome, be part of the team, and feel that their contribution is valued, and welcomed.

As for which age group we should target....I'll target all age groups - but I really want to target those with the right attitude....

Pip

[chook]

Yep totally agree Pip - when I approached my new unit I was welcomed, involved & listen to straight up. It was great!
My previous unit was not & is not a very inviting place & it only took one or two members to bring the tone of the whole place down despite efforts by myself & others to recruit new members these two individuals have manage to almost wreck the unit permanently.
In hindsight I should have got rid of both of them, as neither is an asset to the community or service. I believe they feel threatened by new people - same two voiced strong opposition when I was transfered from Barmera. Luckly they had no choice in the matter
The other thing about my new unit is how professional a prospective member is dealt with compared to SA. Proper recruitment & enlistment pack, quick turn around on paperwork (including police check), good induction process, as soon as you are an official member paperwork for uniforms done - two weeks latter all of your kit arrives from divisional HQ (they even chased up my long service medal paperwork).
There are plenty of training courses to sink your teeth into, and that is as soon as you are a member! unlike SA.
I think there are some valuable lessons to be learnt - that is if its not to late already.
Anyway cheers

[RescueHazmat]

I started cadets at 11, FF at 16, fulltime FF at 19 (while continuing to serve with CFS when off)..

I don't like your statement pixie about bravado and immaturity linking to a common age group in males.. Its a bit like the statements regarding to lifting / dragging ability and men VS women.. - Its just doesn't need to be said.. - And, I personally know of some excellent fire fighters, who were just as good in their late teens.

Bill.. - Fixing the age gap.. Isn't always fixing the younger generation

Finally, remember back to the ages that alot of you / us joined.. - A friend of mine recently criticised younger members joining.. I reminded him that his first fire was on hist 16th Birthday, all those years ago..

[bajdas]

My opinion is that we should take the opportunity to recruit from any age group, background, etc...some will not be suitable for short or long term membership, but some will.

Should we be recruiting for response calls only and thus get the adrenalin junkie ? What about community training so that people understand the consequences of inaction and improving the skills of the community ?

SA Government is trying to get the 'community more resilient' to cope with emergencies. I agree with the strategy, so that this limits how many emergencies happen, rather than riding a truck to a persons injuries/lost/structure/etc.

Some brigades/units/etc agree with this. Look at the number of RCR demonstrations being delivered to High School students & PR displays to prevent a car accident happening.

If a person stays 6 to 12 months, they will have increased life skills. If that helps them get employment, helps them help their family, understand working as a team, the rewards (personal & community) of volunteering and prevents an emergency (eg RCR, fires, land search, etc) then fantastic.

If they walk away with a feeling that volunteering is great, they will tell on average seven other people. The message spreads. Then someone might volunteer with you or with another community organisation. Your community profiles is strengthened.

If you turn them away because of age, they will not come back & the same seven people will get negative feedback. The spreads quicker in the community than good feedback.

Yes, there are costs & time in running courses, PPE, etc. Some of this is reuseable or recoverable. Even if you get that one extra person on the truck so the truck leaves earlier for 6 months, is this not worth the life it could save or the $$$ in restricting the spread of a fire on a farm ?

A few SES Units (4 I can think of) in metro area do group inductions, so the newbies all feel part of a group. They become a team that progresses through training & thus support each other.

One of the major issues I feel is lack of information to base volunteer members.

I understand the need in operations to follow command lines, but a few younger volunteers have contacted me about procedures & lack of information in normal 'day to day' workings. They need to feel part of the whole team, they want information has to why this is being done, how will it affect them, can they assist, etc. They might not agree with the decision, but that is their choice. The 'need to know' process on information blocks too much information flow.

Also, if the social aspect of volunteering is shown, they will form more of a team & relationships with others. This friendship can keep a person in the team. But it can also backfire badly when relationships breakup.

In country areas people talk about combining emergency organisations. Here is the opportunity to do it at a local level. Combine the services (SES & CFS) with a Venturer Scout troop, youth group, Guide group, etc so they complete the emergency badge. Surely a combined SES & CFS cadet group could share funding & local resources ?

** my opinion only & not supported by others **

[Mike]

Mental age is paramount....

The question was raised about people leaving after a short time and it potentially being a waste of training.

I read a study a while ago indicating that most people who participated in emergency services in their twenties and left to start families etc. were much much more likely to re-join a service in their late thirties. Thus the long term benifit of training being much greater.

if they are ready, willing and capable then i dont care how old they are!!!!