Turnout Confirmation

[Pipster]

Some interesting idea there bajdas....can see some useful points.

I can also see some downsides.....in a response to a one vehicle station, with 5 people arriving in a 6 minutes, looking up to see who is walking in the door is going to be quicker than trying to get the print out, read it, comprehend it etc...!!

I like the electronic acknowledgment at the station - but not quite for what you mention - if people "log in" then any additional resources attending after the appliance has left, will know exactly who has gone on the call - something I want to know, if I'm not on the appliance.

As for other people comments re mobile phone - apart from the things already mentioned, there are a few other issues.  Not everyone has a mobile phone.(Believe it or not!!)

And as I have mentioned before, mobile phone don't work everywhere...certainly in my area, the mobile phone coverage is rather dodgy...and I know of several members of the brigade who can drive from their house (where there is virtually no mobile phone coverage) all the way to the station, without getting any coverage.  Depending on where you stand in front of the station, have the wind blowing the right way, stand on one leg, poke you tongue at the right angle, and you might get coverage there too...!!

Pip

[CFS_Firey]

Most stations already have a board with crews availability on them and its a case of when the pager goes off if your available you respond.

Most?  I don't know of any station in my area with such a system... (but maybe I just haven't seen it...)

We have 4 minutes to acknowledge the page for Urban brigades and 6 minutes Rural.
If you dont have the crew and cant respond you then default to next CFS brigade if its CFS area,or back to MFS if its theirs and they will send the next appropriate resource as per SOP's.

But that means you have to wait 6 minutes before you default.  If you already know that no one is coming after 2 minutes, that extra 4 minutes is a lot of wasted time...

Why waste more money on another system

Perhaps because the current one has flaws, and we're trying to provide the best service to the community?

[Robert]

Mt Barker have been running a very simple turnout confirmation system, for a few years now and it works really well. We have found with a large town and the traffic, some of our members can take up to 6min just to get to the station.
   
All our members that live more then two minutes from the station are given a CB radio (little portable hand held- norm kept in their car)
We have a base CB radio in our station (next to our PPE).
The first officer at the station will do a general broadcast "who is mobile to the station" members just reply with e.g. "Andy 3min" “Bob 4min” "Greg 2min”

As an officer this is great as I know:
-How many more crew are coming and what skills they have e.g. (BA, RCR, Driver)
- Whether to get another brigade mobile, if we don't have enough crew coming
-Whether to leave a driver or an officer off the 1st truck to crew 2nd truck
- Whether to wait that extra min for that BA/RCR person WHO IS coming 
- Whether to load up the first truck with six crew or just send 4 or 5 and  keep members back to crew other trucks etc etc etc

We also keep track of our member's availability, with a list on a board in the station of work hours, extra commitments e.g. sports etc.  Anything out side of this our member's page out.

[bajdas]

...I like the electronic acknowledgment at the station - but not quite for what you mention - if people "log in" then any additional resources attending after the appliance has left, will know exactly who has gone on the call - something I want to know, if I'm not on the appliance....

This can be covered manually & the system has been used for many years in SES Units.

Either use a whiteboard where people write their name under a vehicle number has they load in the vehicle or each person has a magnetic name bar on a status board. Then the name is moved to each heading of vehicle, resting, on leave, at LHQ, reserve at home, strike team, etc.

Then the OIC can review the board quickly & know who is where.

My own personal viewpoint, this is essential 'if something goes wrong to a vehicle or crew'. You need to know where everyone is from OHS&W perspective when the Unit/Brigade is operational.

The only downside is that the OIC has the knowledge in their head about the qualifications of the people, any risks by type of incident to individuals & how to contact individuals if required.

Used the status board many years ago to call volunteers families during long operational timeframes, so that the families know what is happening.

[Pipster]

No argument about that badjas!!

The difficulty I have found currently, is working out a suitable manual system to capture the names etc...... white boards, helmet / Key tags, magnetic boards etc.....all possible systems, but finding one to suit, and that works properly, is sometimes not that easy!!

Pip

[6739264]

Ahhh.. Finally the debate turns to ICMS, and the total lack of its use outside of strike teams.

[Gilly]

No argument about that badjas!!

The difficulty I have found currently, is working out a suitable manual system to capture the names etc...... white boards, helmet / Key tags, magnetic boards etc.....all possible systems, but finding one to suit, and that works properly, is sometimes not that easy!!

Pip

We simply look at what helmets and gear are not hanging up. Unless someone is on a course (and generally you know who is doing a course), their gear should be there. It works for us quite well.

[rescue5271]

I Just spoke to a friend in CFA and he said the pager system was tested in regio 8 and only a handful of briagde's took part in it,like anything it had problems and they are now looking into something much better...So i guess watch this space.

[jaff]

There is nothing more frustrating than waiting for the arrival of that last one or two firies before the appliance goes mobile, certainly be nice to see some appropriate system across the state. The pagers are now what 4 -5 years old so their realistic service life is coming to a end soon, it would be interesting to see if Comms are looking at enhanced services on the next gen of pagers! Maybe they will do that, right after SACAD tehehe

[bajdas]

I like the CFS Mt Barker system of UHF portables. Simply to use & accurate.

I assume the UHF CB's can also be used at the tasking because everyone in the crew is already carrying one.

Pity so many 'idiots' on the UHF CB's in metropoloitan area that would restrict operation on a pre-determined frequency.

Do you experience any issues of the frequency already being used ??

[6739264]

The downfall of brigade based systems is that there is no indication to comms as to the status of brigade members. If comms has "Unable to respond" from 19/20 members within the first minute, its then easy to turnout another brigade without having to wait for confirmation from the brigade itself. Its great that Barker use a system that works for them, but lets not forget that they are a busy and switched on brigade, which puts them certainly in the minority of CFS briagdes.

[Robert-Robert34]

In theory the system of brigade members having UHF CB Radios in their own vehicles and calling the base say they are responding to the station e.t.a of such and such is a good idea but getting the approval from group officers and the regional offices would be difficult if you wanted to put this system into practial use
 

[Katrina]

I've got nothing sensible to add to this subject,I still have the picture in my head of Pip standing on one leg out the front of the fire station, leaning to one side with her tongue stuck out attempting to get phone service. Does it help if you hold an umbrella as well??

[24pumper]

I like the CFS Mt Barker system of UHF portables. Simply to use & accurate.

I assume the UHF CB's can also be used at the tasking because everyone in the crew is already carrying one.

I would hope they aren't using it as a fireground radio, when there is an existing VHF & GRN simplex system in place for firegound communication. What happens when the next brigade turn up but crews cant communicate as one brigade has a different system?

[Robert-Robert34]

True 24pumper but you can use UHF CB handhelds for communication between pump operator and radio operator 

[Cameron Yelland]

Not many brigades have a .5 member around to utilise as a radio operator......most of the time the pumpie is the radio operator!

[bajdas]

I like the CFS Mt Barker system of UHF portables. Simply to use & accurate.

I assume the UHF CB's can also be used at the tasking because everyone in the crew is already carrying one.

I would hope they aren't using it as a fireground radio, when there is an existing VHF & GRN simplex system in place for firegound communication. What happens when the next brigade turn up but crews cant communicate as one brigade has a different system?

OK, I am from an organisation that only has GRN for local communication. Some of the vehicles have UHF CB installed (also HF but that  is long distance) & a heap of UHF CB portables were used at a fireground staging camp. But I am not sure if many Units have them.

Some Units do use them for communication between team leader & first aider in the vehicle at RCR. I have also heard them being used in other situations (between ground & roof crews, hauling & cliff face, etc).

Agreed not suitable for multi brigade communication, but I think still useful for local comms that does not carry any confidential information.

[JC]

We run an emergency callout system here at work. We ring a 1800 number request a turnout of off duty ESO and ERT members, the call centre hits a button and every member on that list gets a phone call with a recorded message saying emergency response required, then all the person has to do is press the matching option ie 1 am attending, 2 delayed etc. If the person doesnt answer there phone a text is sent with options to follow.

The whole process between the first call to the 1800 No. to the person sending a response is 1 min. When then can get a report back indicating response numbers, allowing us to determin if external assistance is required.

[pumprescue]

True 24pumper but you can use UHF CB handhelds for communication between pump operator and radio operator 

Wow, do people still actually do this......

[mattb]

In theory the system of brigade members having UHF CB Radios in their own vehicles and calling the base say they are responding to the station e.t.a of such and such is a good idea but getting the approval from group officers and the regional offices would be difficult if you wanted to put this system into practial use

Robert, why would you need approval from the Group Officers or Region to install a UHF radio in your fire station ?? And why would they knock it back ??

We have been running this system for a number of years now with our more distant members and day crew guys calling up and advising their ETA to the station, seems to work pretty well for us.

[SA Firey]

In theory the system of brigade members having UHF CB Radios in their own vehicles and calling the base say they are responding to the station e.t.a of such and such is a good idea but getting the approval from group officers and the regional offices would be difficult if you wanted to put this system into practial use

Robert, why would you need approval from the Group Officers or Region to install a UHF radio in your fire station ?? And why would they knock it back ??

We have been running this system for a number of years now with our more distant members and day crew guys calling up and advising their ETA to the station, seems to work pretty well for us.

Robert Robert Robert....I think you should think about what you are going to say before you post....while UHF CB is not endorsed by CFSHQ as a reliable communication method it has been adopted by many brigades and especially farm fire units with great success.
With that attitude no wonder the DOO cant get new members

[Darius]

In theory the system of brigade members having UHF CB Radios in their own vehicles and calling the base say they are responding to the station e.t.a of such and such is a good idea but getting the approval from group officers and the regional offices would be difficult if you wanted to put this system into practial use

Robert, why would you need approval from the Group Officers or Region to install a UHF radio in your fire station ?? And why would they knock it back ??

We have been running this system for a number of years now with our more distant members and day crew guys calling up and advising their ETA to the station, seems to work pretty well for us.

Robert Robert Robert....I think you should think about what you are going to say before you post....while UHF CB is not endorsed by CFSHQ as a reliable communication method it has been adopted by many brigades and especially farm fire units with great success.
With that attitude no wonder the DOO cant get new members

actually UHF CB is not only endorsed but all new (and refurbished) appliances will now come fitted with one (the ICOM IC440).  UHF CB is already in extensive use within CFS in many parts of the state and this now makes it official.

[Bagyassfirey]

we rely on our UHF radios in our group hugely to communicate with ouprivate units because with out them we would be filtered stuffed.

[CFS_Firey]

actually UHF CB is not only endorsed but all new (and refurbished) appliances will now come fitted with one (the ICOM IC440).  UHF CB is already in extensive use within CFS in many parts of the state and this now makes it official.

Are there any plans to install them into stations also?

[Robert-Robert34]

actually UHF CB is not only endorsed but all new (and refurbished) appliances will now come fitted with one (the ICOM IC440).  UHF CB is already in extensive use within CFS in many parts of the state and this now makes it official.

Are there any plans to install them into stations also?

Saying if UHF CB's are installed in stations as per what CFS_Firey has asked will they be installed in every station or just in the stations where the call out rate is much higher ?