Private Assistance

[SA- Private- Contractor]

Withdrawn due to circumstances 190708

[21337]

we should have specialists, like in the police we should have specialised personal. we have it for the urban rescue why not in other semi specialised situations?

[Cameron Yelland]

Between the police, the Rescue chopper (whoever crews that), SES, CFS & MFS i dont think there is any vertical rescue job we would not be able to handle.

Also would the private sector be able to guarantee a timely response?

[SA- Private- Contractor]

Withdrawn due to circumstances 190708

[chook]

There is a team - it sits within SES - special operations, consist of paid and volunteer members. They have done extensive training in this area.
And no I would not consider using private contractors, except to provide cranes etc.
And after seeing the conversation on rope rescue, this is the way it should remain.
I am current in vertical access & have done the civilian work at height course (& after being told by a provider that the whole vertical rescue package is taught in 5 days from novice to teamleader) I would not trust private contractors to perform such a task.
I know the guys in special ops & personality issues aside (this only applies to some) I would trust them with my kids lives, can't say that about contractors who's prime motivation is profit. Sorry but I've seen too many short cuts in the private sector!
Emergency Service Provision in this state is the job of the 3 government providers.
cheers

[jaff]

 Is a private contractor exempt, under the emergency services act if it goes tits up?. As they are contracted and put themselves out there as specialists,it would be interesting.  Would be a helll of a public liability insurance premium if it was available!

cheeres Jaff

[bittenyakka]

I would be very likely to consult the owners of the facility on the rescue operation, and if they had already arranged with some private contractor or trained their own crews then yes i would have them responded at least.

But the due to differing situations of all rescues i cant give a blanket answer.

I would like to do a vert Rescue course as there is something awesome about hanging above the ground.

[Zippy]

bit different to privatized emergency services, a winery in my area has trained its own staff in Confine Spaced and BA operation to use in the Wine Vats in the event of a rescue situation.

General rule of thumb in my books...Privatization sucks.

[bittenyakka]

Didn't MFS used to be private?

[Pipster]

rescue chopper i believe is through private heli company, same guys who do the 9, 7 and 10 choppers (i think)

The rescue choppers are provided through a private company (currently Australian Helicopters) ... but rescue crews come from SAAS or SAPol... and perhaps other recognised emergency services ?   (The only ones I have been involved with have been with SAPol & SAAS - don't know if Surf Life Saving provided crews.....?)

Pip

[49194]

We have STAR, Rescue Paramedics (SOT), the SES with their Vert Rescue teams..


No, I dont personally think we need a private / outsourced 'team' for it.

[CFS_Firey]

There's no "YES" in your poll... was that deliberate?

I would support using private contractors at incidents, particularly at Hazmats.  Why waste volunteers time when there are people out there trained to do the same job that are trying to make a living doing it?

[chook]

Zippy most places that have confine space or work at height (i.e. work in harnesses) will have trained people on site (thats why at work we have people trained in confine space, Hazmat, & rescue from height) however as soon as an incident occurs the emergency services must be contacted & on arrival hand over to the OIC of the emergency service who responded. That is the training provided by private contractors. E.g I have a fire, Rescue (confine space & height)& Hazmat team (trained in ammonia, chlorine, caustics/ acids), the first thing is to raise the alarm, two respond to the incident & contact the emergency service, 3 combat the emergency until the Professionals arrive, then if required assist the emergency services.
Virtually all training for industry is provided by current or ex fire service members working for various training providers, therefore it would be very unusual for the said training providers to promote going alone. Example the commercial fire fighting course is two days with hardly any real practice (except for bowling hoses, rolling up hoses, fire rescue etc) ask your self this does that compare with BFF1? Add three days for BA & confine space & two days for hazmat (spill response + the gases mentioned), how doesthat compare with the professionals?
So as I said who would you prefer? And SES has a team that can be flown any where in the state, so why would we need anymore? Clean up of certain hazmats is different, as they have very specialised knowledge.
cheers

[RescueHazmat]

There's no "YES" in your poll... was that deliberate?

I would support using private contractors at incidents, particularly at Hazmats.  Why waste volunteers time when there are people out there trained to do the same job that are trying to make a living doing it?

Not all incidents are attended too by Vollies.. - As has been said before, this is the SAFIREFIGHTER board, not soley a SACFS board..

[chook]

Exactly well said

[Firefrog]

Lot's of variables in this question.

While I don't think we have a need for a vertical rescue contractor as the state currently has the skills, there are certainly times when special skills are needed.

Companies that offer special skills or equipment can be called upon in times of need eg think of bulldozer operators, Airport Fire going to fuel tankers or service stations fires etc. etc.

If the need arises and the skills/equipment is available I don't see too any issues.

If we needed vertical rescue specialists there is one company I can think of that is so well trained internationally it boggles the mind! The state is well placed with best of the best expertise in vertical rescue.

[CFS_Firey]

There's no "YES" in your poll... was that deliberate?

I would support using private contractors at incidents, particularly at Hazmats.  Why waste volunteers time when there are people out there trained to do the same job that are trying to make a living doing it?

Not all incidents are attended too by Vollies.. - As has been said before, this is the SAFIREFIGHTER board, not soley a SACFS board..

Sorry.

But my point still stands for CFS area

[Cameron Yelland]

There's no "YES" in your poll... was that deliberate?

I would support using private contractors at incidents, particularly at Hazmats.  Why waste volunteers time when there are people out there trained to do the same job that are trying to make a living doing it?

Thats almost like saying why waste vollies time at all at any incident.  Just call the MFS in at the start and let the CFS go home.

Vollies have done the courses to deal with these situations and if they werent prepared to put in the long hours they wouldnt volunteer.

Why is it everyone assumes vollies need assistance just because we arent paid?

[24pumper]

There's no "YES" in your poll... was that deliberate?

I would support using private contractors at incidents, particularly at Hazmats.  Why waste volunteers time when there are people out there trained to do the same job that are trying to make a living doing it?

Thats almost like saying why waste vollies time at all at any incident.  Just call the MFS in at the start and let the CFS go home.

Vollies have done the courses to deal with these situations and if they werent prepared to put in the long hours they wouldnt volunteer.

Why is it everyone assumes vollies need assistance just because we arent paid?

Cammo,

I dont think it was refering to MFS coming to save us as we arent capable at all. I think the reference was to HazMat incidents that are not an emergency any more, eg no threat to life property or environment. Should it not be the responsibility of a private contracting company specialising in Hazardous material clean-up to take over from the fire service (MFS or CFS[or WES]). Should vols be spending hours of their own time cleaning up a chemical spill where no danger to life/property exists, thus leaving their own communities with a reduced ability to deal with other emergencies.

24p

[rescue5271]

There is no need to get outside service involved as those that do this type of work/training are instructed by the best in the field who come from the private sector.SA contractor i think you really have a few issue's with how we are trained and may be you have tryed to talk to those at the top in MFS/CFS/SES and they have not taken you up on any of your offers...Would I be correct in saying that?? As for the choppers yes them may be run by a private firm but they are manned by trained members from police/saas/cfs/ses/mfs

[Cameron Yelland]

There's no "YES" in your poll... was that deliberate?

I would support using private contractors at incidents, particularly at Hazmats.  Why waste volunteers time when there are people out there trained to do the same job that are trying to make a living doing it?

Thats almost like saying why waste vollies time at all at any incident.  Just call the MFS in at the start and let the CFS go home.

Vollies have done the courses to deal with these situations and if they werent prepared to put in the long hours they wouldnt volunteer.

Why is it everyone assumes vollies need assistance just because we arent paid?

Cammo,

I dont think it was refering to MFS coming to save us as we arent capable at all. I think the reference was to HazMat incidents that are not an emergency any more, eg no threat to life property or environment. Should it not be the responsibility of a private contracting company specialising in Hazardous material clean-up to take over from the fire service (MFS or CFS[or WES]). Should vols be spending hours of their own time cleaning up a chemical spill where no danger to life/property exists, thus leaving their own communities with a reduced ability to deal with other emergencies.

24p

Nah i just used the MFS as an example because their paid.  After you explaining it further it now makes more sense.

Just seems people these days keep referring to the vollie as someone who cant afford to give their day to help out.

[CFS_Firey]

Nah i just used the MFS as an example because their paid.  After you explaining it further it now makes more sense.

Just seems people these days keep referring to the vollie as someone who cant afford to give their day to help out.

Yes, I was mostly referring to incidents that aren't a life threat anymore, extended Hazmats, Trees on driveways, possibly even blacking out at large fires. 

I think part of the reason the CFS is facing a volunteer shortage is because - exactly as you said - people aren't willing to put in the long hours, so they don't volunteer.

[chook]

I agree after the Renmark & Pinaroo storms - emergency services provide initial response but once the initial threat is over councils & contractors take over the cleanup. And that is how contractors should be used.

[SA- Private- Contractor]

Withdrawn due to circumstances 190708

[chook]

It might surprise you but things have moved on since the 90's.
Not sure who you spoke to at SAMFS & don't care (nothing personal SAMFS). SAMFS do not cover the whole state for rescue! They have distinct areas of operations & the rest of the state is covered by CFS & SES.
I suggest before you make any further comment on this topic or any other regarding specialist rescue in this state you contact the Commander Special operations State Emergency Service South Australia.
I'm sure he would be very interested in your ideas!
And it does not matter how many companies provide rescue expertise, just like fire ALL rescues on Land & inland bodies of come under the Fire & Emergency Services Act, so are therefore the responsibility of SAMFS,CFS rescue units & SESSA (Federal Land excluded). And until the act is changed we will always be responsible for the provision of emergency response in this state, so you will have to wait awhile. By the way in my other life I provide OHS expertise to a major Australian company & would never advocate the use of private contractors to surplant the role & responsibilities of SAMFS, CFS or SES.
In fact my company is a proud supporter of the emergency services across the country (even pays for staff to attend callouts etc) & they would be horrified if I suggested using a private contractor to provide a service that they already pay for!
End of lecture
cheers