DEAD HOSE REELS

[rescue5271]

Most hill's brigade's would have by now have seen the MT BOLD 34 with its dead hose reel that is sitting above the live hose reel on the rear of this appliance's..What do members think of this and should CFS look at having these on appliances?? CFA have had these for years and they work well reel can hold up to 5 x 38mm hose with wajax fittings,easy to drain and wind back up onto the reel...

[Cameron Yelland]

I could definately see a benefit to brigades with large amounts of forest or scrub.  Having said that, the forestry sa firekings have dead reels but they dont use them.

Having canvas wound on the figure 8 works well also.

[CFS_Firey]

I could definately see a benefit to brigades with large amounts of forest or scrub.  Having said that, the forestry sa firekings have dead reels but they dont use them.

Having canvas wound on the figure 8 works well also.

I haven't used dead hose reels, so I don't know much about their use - does this mean they'd be no good for house fires where you also need 38mmm hose fast?

[Cameron Yelland]

I dont see why they wouldnt be any good for structure fires.  Just means you would be using canvas rather than rubber.

Same principle as flaked hose i guess.

[wilma]

mainly used in a forest or scrub type situation barossa group have used the forestry lay for quit some time the dead reel is great it enables you to extend hose lengths quick when done correct. If you get a chance do the forestry course it opens your eyes to a lot of diffrent techniques

[Red Message]

So is it just like flaked hose, but you pull it off the reel? So if the reel hold 8x25mm lengths, and you need two, you run two out, disconnect from the reel, connect to the pump and off you go? It sounds good for 25mm, I don't know about anything larger.

Is there still the need to run all the hose off the reel first before supplying water to the line? I could see a fair possibility of squashing the drum or damaging hoses if this was the case and people weren't careful about it.

[Cameron Yelland]

Forestry SA have 38mm on their dead reels.

Basically grab the hose and run till you get to flames then disconnect and connect to outlet.  Any extra hose will need to be added with the aid of a hose clamp or disconnect the hose and lug all that water up the hill 

[6739264]

Christ. They sound ok for plantation areas, but on every appliance? Good god no. Just imagine how people will try and use them. People have enough issues using the current stowage on appliances.

[bittenyakka]

can i suggest using flaked hose in CFS?

[Pipster]

But aren't we talksing about how we store our current hose, rather than adding more?

While we don't have a dead reel, there are times at some fires - particularly large & long mop ups, where making one side reel a dead reel for the shift works well - knowing that you will be pulling lots of hose, using it, rolling it up, moving & then repeating the whole thing again!

The other things is to get a Peter Green hose winding handle, so those times when you can roll up layflats, you can do it off the appliance, standing up, with ease!!

Pip

[bittenyakka]

those hose winders are good

on KI we used laylfat looped off the back of the truck and flaked 38 in the crew deck and it worked really well for quickly getting to spotfires. however i think by the time you run out 60 M of hose it is easier to take the rolls to the branch end.

[RescueHazmat]

can i suggest using flaked hose in CFS?

Where have you been the last 5 or more years?.. Alot of appliances/brigades used flaked line..

[bittenyakka]

I have only been in CFS for just over 2 and in general i get a "thank god we don;t use flaked any more" or similar response.  however i like the idea of atleast 1 38 mm preconnect on urban/rural brigades. (mind you many  members do the same with sidelines duh)

[6739264]

I have only been in CFS for just over 2 and in general i get a "thank god we don;t use flaked any more" or similar response.  however i like the idea of atleast 1 38 mm preconnect on urban/rural brigades. (mind you many  members do the same with sidelines duh)

Thank god we don't use flaked anymore? Is that because people are too lazy to spend 5 minutes reflaking the used hose?

Nothing wrong with having both flaked hose and rolled hose on the truck, there should be more than enough. That then gives you the choice of what to use.

Mate, you're going to have problems with one length of 38mm. If you have a job, you're still going to need to break down the line and add in atleast one more length. 2 lengths should be the minimum as it allows you plenty of room to move, and enough to get to work straight of the truck and into a building.

I'm certainly a fan of having both 38 and 64 flaked... One day...

[JamesGar]

[img]http://www.fesa.wa.gov.au/internet/upload/1442403776/images/Image143[img]

Here's a 'real' dead hose reel!

I think this POD from FESA - WA can lay approprimately 2 kilometres of 64mm hose, with the ability to mechanically rewind!

Cool

[Gilly]

Picture didn't load. here it is.

[Stefan KIRKMOE]

Flaked is awesome!

Burnside Pumper has 4 x 64mm (maybe 5 i can't remember) on the roof of reverse lay which works wonders when you're running with a standpipe, plate cover key and turncock key (maybe even a torch!) and you can go a distance of 80 to 100m.... Not to mention you can still do it while the truck is still driving to the job....

Also we run a 64mm with 50mm working length flaked in the hose locker, that too is very simple and easy to use, have used it now at a number of going jobs and would suggest it to anyone with the space....

Stefan

[Zippy]

anyone with the space....

haha!

[bittenyakka]

Sounds awesome I'll put a reverse lay on the tank of 24   

[rescue5271]

Dead hose reels have been around for years and work well both in a urban and rural area,as does flake hose as long as its set up corretly.For those people that have never used any of these dont knock it till you try it, go do the plantation course and you will see just how useful this can be for firefighting both in a urban and rural firefighting. If you think having a dead reel is a good idea then start asking CFS to put them on appliances if SA WATER can have them why can't we???

[6739264]

Dare I suggest that in the future it would be good to see, on certain appliances, a mix of dead hose reels for 25mm and flaked for both 38 and 64.

Now all we need are modular fire trucks, rather than 1001 prototypes.

[Hicksflat14]

go do the plantation course and you will see just how useful this can be for firefighting both in a urban and rural firefighting.

Well for starters unless your regional office thinks your local area has a plantation in it and likely to be a first responder you can't actually get on a plantation course. Hicksflat brigade has responded to many plantation fires and has a small plantation in its area, yet our member's nominations are rejected for the plantation courses as its not deemed necessary by region for the local risk profile.

Secondly how is a plantation course going to indicate how well it works in urban areas? Plantation areas are mostly reasonably flat (yes I know there are plantations on steep grades too) with little undergrowth. For metro work and many urban jobs I don't think you can beat a decent pump with a high pressure stage and good HP line.

If you think having a dead reel is a good idea then start asking CFS to put them on appliances if SA WATER can have them why can't we?Huh??

Personally I don't want one but there is nothing stopping a brigade taking a live hose off and putting on layflat if they think that it is better for their situation. There is nothing unique about the current spools that makes it not suitable to act as a dead reel. But thank you for a bit of diversity, its good to hear a refreshing take on the "If MFS can have them why can't we?" argument usually played out here.

[6739264]

For metro work and many urban jobs I don't think you can beat a decent pump with a high pressure stage and good HP line.

Its very beatable. Its called a low pressure stage and a line of 38. Unless of course, by 'urban jobs' you mean nothing but bins and cars.

[Gilly]

Its very beatable. Its called a low pressure stage and a line of 38. Unless of course, by 'urban jobs' you mean nothing but bins and cars.

I disagree. For most structure and general urban work, a 38 is a)overkill, b) not agile and manouverable c) slower to deploy (than HP) d) takes longer to make up

Remember that with salvage, damage minimisation etc, having more water is not neccissarily a good thing. Using less water more effectively is better. Obviously when defensive firefighting is involved, it changes slightly, but for most internal work i'd rather a HP line over a 38. 

Deadreels have their place, but as for 64mm, flaked is more compact and quicker. Yes the make up time is slower, but its comparible with dutch rolling hose.

[6739264]

I disagree. For most structure and general urban work, a 38 is a)overkill, b) not agile and manouverable c) slower to deploy (than HP) d) takes longer to make up

Remember that with salvage, damage minimisation etc, having more water is not neccissarily a good thing. Using less water more effectively is better. Obviously when defensive firefighting is involved, it changes slightly, but for most internal work i'd rather a HP line over a 38.   

We could get into a discussion that will go around and around, because as per usual, we all have differing experiences, but I will say that points A, B and C, certainly don't fit with my experience
.
The amount of water used on a fire comes down to the operator of the branch, I'd rather have a hose I can dial down, rather than one (HP) that is left wanting in the literage department.

If anything, I find 38 MORE maneuverable than 25mm Rawhide HP lines. But of course it all depends on circumstance.

If you've got a switched on pump operator, then he should be able to have a 60m line of 38 setup for the BA operators to take by the time they have donned their sets. If you've got BA in the Cab, then the time it takes the operators to walk and grab the HP line, they could just have easily have taken helped the Pump operator finish setting up the line of 38.

I'm happy to take a line of 38 that will cover my arse if everything turns pear shaped, or if fire conditions inside are not what we expect. Nothing says you have to use your 38 at 475lpm all the time...