burn over drill

[rescue5271]

Who ever wrote the burn overdrill and the scene of the job,must think we are all fools who in their right mind would send crews into the scrub with those conditions....NOT ME.....

[Crank]

The weather conditions stated in the burnover drill are just a common extreme fire day.  50 FDI

Those weather conditions were seen 10 or more times last season.

As FF83 and i have said work from an anchor point and you will almost always be safe.

[ff83]

I was never suggesting let a forest burn, nor not attack a fire in extreme conditions I was mealy stating that when you leave the edge of a fire you can get yourself in trouble.

Mealy suggesting that we should let a scrub fire burn (the abandoned) house analogy is laughable. On extreme days this attitude leads to fires that become completely uncontrollable.

Crew position is key and is something that SA fire crews do very badly. The safe anchor point and keeping the immediate option to move onto burnt ground open, is key to staying safe. Leaving a fire to burn when close enough to see the fire (as opposed to back burning) is not an option.

[track400m]

I think it is stupid that the cfs does it once a year and the same drill why dont they do it in different scenarios

[misterteddy]

I think it is stupid that the cfs does it once a year and the same drill why dont they do it in different scenarios

<slaps forehead>....do you REALLY really need someone to write a scenario to complete this?? Surely the important part of the drill is to work out the return signal, what to do with pumps, hoses, valves and switches, and then to find and don the appropriate in cabin protective stuff. Spending precious staff resources writing simplistic scenarios and then circulating them service wide would appear to me to be an immense waste of time and an exercise in egg sucking for anyone in the service more than 2 years. Just a quick tick off sheets for skills and a return sheet to Region for arse covering purposes should be all that is needed. If you want a story for your drill, make one fit that is locally relevent, surely u can do that, and if you can't please don't come and play on my fireground I don't trust you?

[Alex]

I think it is stupid that the cfs does it once a year and the same drill why dont they do it in different scenarios

Just flip the siren to yelp in the middle of whatever training drill your already doing and walla.... burnover drill.

[Pipster]

How many different scenarios can you get for a burn over drill...?

I would have thought just one..... fire's coming, appliance can't escape before fire arrives, take cover, do the appropriate things on the appliance / radio / with pumps / hoses etc, once 'passed' check on crews, appliance & surrounds.  Can't see much else to it.

And as Alex says, chuck a burn over drill in the middle of something else you are doing..... my brigade does that a number of times over spring / summer training...  it's good practice, and doesn't take long!  Nothing required from HQ to get it done.....

Pip

[tft]

[misterteddy]

clearly this does not represent more than 50% of our fellow firefighters, whom wouldn't be as aware as Homer

[6739264]

I'm still stumped at the fact that we moved from using an almost internationally recognizable fireground evacuation signal to one that is used during the normal course of appliance movements during an incident.

Very intelligent.

[Mic10110]

What about those GO's and DGO's who's SMD#1 has expired but they are still operating on the fireground? Does someone up the tree cross check the AIRS listed personel against SMD#1 accreditation in TAS?

[jaff]

What about those GO's and DGO's who's SMD#1 has expired but they are still operating on the fireground? Does someone up the tree cross check the AIRS listed personel against SMD#1 accreditation in TAS?

Perhaps they could make up the big % of personnel that dont achieve their accreditation every year!, but I doubt it!

[rescue5271]

In our group all groupies have done it and do it each year still waiting to see when the command cars will have a burn over drill...don't know why they don't look at interstate and how they do it it's not rocket science....

[misterteddy]

don't know why they don't look at interstate and how they do it it's not rocket science....

surely we dont have to have east coast penis envy and follow them because they must be right.... as  you say, it's not hard, surely we can pretend to be professional enough to sort it out ourselves.

[gilfire99]

Bill, believe me you blokes are way in front of us on this one. In my opinion burn over drill is one of the things that SA do better than NSW. Fire overrun as it is called here ( we're the RFS, why use someone else's terminology when you can invent your own) is taught at BF level (initial course) then basically forgotten about until it's needed! There is no regular structured competency to maintain.
The smarter and more switched-on captains and T/Os ensure it's practiced regularly often without warning during a normal practical session. I downloaded the drill from the SACFS site (with permission) and distributed it to my brigades. It is also a regular feature at Regional and State exercises.

[gilfire99]

surely we dont have to have east coast penis envy and follow them because they must be right.... as  you say, it's not hard, surely we can pretend to be professional enough to sort it out ourselves.

Thank you misterteddy, I'm flattered

[rescue5271]

I guess one day we will see the paperwork for burn over drill in command cars,but for now we have our own idea on how it should be done...

[KDOO_BTO]

Hi Guys,
Just after your thoughts.  TFS are starting to do a similar thing, as part of their drill they are taking firelighters, fuel cans, chainsaws etc off the truck and placing them away from the truck.  If possible the truck is to be placed so that the front of the truck is facing towards where the fire is coming from.  I'm not saying I agree or disagree with either just curious about every ones thoughts, the TFS boys are divided on it. But if these are good ideas it could help improve the CFS drill

[misterteddy]

Hi Guys,
Just after your thoughts.  TFS are starting to do a similar thing, as part of their drill they are taking firelighters, fuel cans, chainsaws etc off the truck and placing them away from the truck.  If possible the truck is to be placed so that the front of the truck is facing towards where the fire is coming from.  I'm not saying I agree or disagree with either just curious about every ones thoughts, the TFS boys are divided on it. But if these are good ideas it could help improve the CFS drill

you mean the front of the truck.....the part with the glass and rubber and plastic in it....where the people are kept?.....as opposed to the back of the truck, where the bits of crap that can be replaced live, the back....thats as far away from the front, where the people are kept? If we get down to worrying about the 1L of 1:25 mix in the chainsaw.....shits are really trumps. Spend the time more usefully fighting for a piece of the single crew protection blanket the CFS kindly provides that magically isnt affected by the division between front and back seats. Maybe the Tas boys should try thinking with the other head....they seem to have too tight a grip on the current one

[KDOO_BTO]

Hi Guys,
Just after your thoughts.  TFS are starting to do a similar thing, as part of their drill they are taking firelighters, fuel cans, chainsaws etc off the truck and placing them away from the truck.  If possible the truck is to be placed so that the front of the truck is facing towards where the fire is coming from.  I'm not saying I agree or disagree with either just curious about every ones thoughts, the TFS boys are divided on it. But if these are good ideas it could help improve the CFS drill

Their idea is that the front windscreen is the toughest window in the truck and is less likely to break when hit with the fire.
you mean the front of the truck.....the part with the glass and rubber and plastic in it....where the people are kept?.....as opposed to the back of the truck, where the bits of crap that can be replaced live, the back....thats as far away from the front, where the people are kept? If we get down to worrying about the 1L of 1:25 mix in the chainsaw.....shits are really trumps. Spend the time more usefully fighting for a piece of the single crew protection blanket the CFS kindly provides that magically isnt affected by the division between front and back seats. Maybe the Tas boys should try thinking with the other head....they seem to have too tight a grip on the current one

[tft]

Hi Guys,
Just after your thoughts.  TFS are starting to do a similar thing, as part of their drill they are taking firelighters, fuel cans, chainsaws etc off the truck and placing them away from the truck.  If possible the truck is to be placed so that the front of the truck is facing towards where the fire is coming from.  I'm not saying I agree or disagree with either just curious about every ones thoughts, the TFS boys are divided on it. But if these are good ideas it could help improve the CFS drill

you mean the front of the truck.....the part with the glass and rubber and plastic in it....where the people are kept?.....as opposed to the back of the truck, where the bits of crap that can be replaced live, the back....thats as far away from the front, where the people are kept? If we get down to worrying about the 1L of 1:25 mix in the chainsaw.....shits are really trumps. Spend the time more usefully fighting for a piece of the single crew protection blanket the CFS kindly provides that magically isnt affected by the division between front and back seats. Maybe the Tas boys should try thinking with the other head....they seem to have too tight a grip on the current one

You mean stick your head between your legs and kiss your a_ss goodbye.
I thought it was a magic blanket

[misterteddy]

KDOO..... you mean the front windscreen offers more protection than the rear cab window, that in just about every truck these days is protected by either a crew deck structure, or at least lockers, or pump, or at worst, distance from the flames.....   

[KDOO_BTO]

I didn't say I agreed with them but that was the arguement they put to me

[gilfire99]

In NSW we technically teach the same thing re removing all the gear from the appliance, but practically, if you have time to do all that then you have time to get the hell out! As for appliance positioning, back to the approaching fire, hopefully you would already have the appliance facing this way if you are considering your escape routes.

[track400m]

just wondering im a firefighter in another organisation in australia over xmas i come home am i aloud onto the truck or do i have to do my burnover again