Copping abuse at jobs.

[uniden]

I recently attended an incident where CFS and MFS were in attendance at a rubbish fire. The call was made by the local council inspector as some people were burning a large pile of tree branches out of hours. The particular council only allows burning this time of year between 10 and 3 mon-saturday. This particular burn was conducted on a Sunday, therefore illegal.
Upon arrival the CFS and MFS crews were subject to a tirade of abusive language from clearly intoxicated people. These people although were breaking the law were unhappy that the crews were about to start putting water on the fire. As a further fire appliance arrived the people settled down a little.

I realise that it is an offence for members of the public to hinder fire crews from performing their duties, but is it an offence to verbally accost them? Police were not called to this incident, but should have been. Any thoughts?

[SA Firey]

Any job where there is violence on scene or directed at crews Police should be called.As this incident was a clear breach of the regulations they should have been pinched for the offence.

All fires should be attended by a Police patrol and any offences reported.

Also for those that dont know all fixed/private alarms calls are charged for as of 1st August 2007. 
See http://www.samfs.sa.gov.au/FalseAlarms/SAMFSCodes.asp

[bittenyakka]

Like CFS charges them or the Brigade?

[SA Firey]

SAFECOM will send a bill

[Pipster]

Any job where there is violence on scene or directed at crews Police should be called.As this incident was a clear breach of the regulations they should have been pinched for the offence.

All fires should be attended by a Police patrol and any offences reported.

but burning rubbish in the back yard, outside the fire danger season, doesn't come under police jurisdiction...it is a council matter....and unless individual police officers have been specifically authorised by the specific council, as a council inspector, then the Police officer cannot pinch the people for the fire in the circumstances outlined.....

Uniden, was the Council Inspector on scene when you got there, or was it just a ring through and asked to attend?

And what power was CFS / MFS using to extinguish the fire...?

As for abuse by residents...again, whether police can pinch them for the abuse, it depends on what is said, where it is audible from etc......

Pip

[JC]

If the crews are getting abused, paid or volly, sit back and call the boys/girls in blue and wait for them before anymore action is taken.

[BHPESO]

the same thing happens at work,  some people become quiet irate when we drug test them,  But its all about attitude and reafirming who has the power,  Calm and defuse the situation to prevent it from escalating, and call for assistance at the same time.

[backburn]

When my brigade attended a House fire we where approached by a member of the public not happy no one knows why but he started to abuse us, as I was putting on my BA set he smashed me in the side of the head with something then as I tried to finish getting donned up he then punched me in the face. My husband was also trying to get donned up and was shocked by what had happened but we had to keep moving as we had three gas bottles venting. When the police arrived they took him away but did not charge him with anything pity.

[RescueHazmat]

You could have asked the Police to have him charged with Assault.

[uniden]

The council inpector was not on scene. I think she recieved a complaint about the situation, drove past and then called us without remaining on scene. Crews extinguished the fire as the landowner refused to and he was breaching the clean air act. This was carried out at the request of the inspector..

[Alan (Big Al)]

When my brigade attended a House fire we where approached by a member of the public not happy no one knows why but he started to abuse us, as I was putting on my BA set he smashed me in the side of the head with something then as I tried to finish getting donned up he then punched me in the face. My husband was also trying to get donned up and was shocked by what had happened but we had to keep moving as we had three gas bottles venting. When the police arrived they took him away but did not charge him with anything pity.

A fire helmet makes a pretty good defensive weapon against people like that.

Would have thought someone would have jumped the bloke after the first hit

[bajdas]

....Would have thought someone would have jumped the bloke after the first hit

The you can be charged with assault & the situation escalates to a fight...lovely if media or other members of the public witness the professionalism.

[Pipster]

The council inpector was not on scene. I think she recieved a complaint about the situation, drove past and then called us without remaining on scene. Crews extinguished the fire as the landowner refused to and he was breaching the clean air act. This was carried out at the request of the inspector..

I think you'll find the Clean Air Act no longer exists...been incorporated into other Acts....

Had the Council Inspector spoken to the residents, and told them to extinguish their fire?  A simple drive by, and then sending the fire services to do the job means that the fire service is being left high & dry in relation to their power to extinguish a fire, at this time of year...I would expect that the Council Inspector would have to advise the residents that they are breaching council bylaws, and to extinguish the fire.  If the residents refuse, then the Council Inspector, I expect,  would have the power to then extinguish that fire, using such assistants to help (which might include the fire services).  The fire services are then using the Council Inspectors power to extinguish the fire...

I know it is difficult when you just get the call via a pager message, and advised to go and put the fire out - but unless the fire is posing a risk to other property, I would be requesting the Council Inspectors attendance at the scene, and go from there...

Pip

[pumprescue]

The fire service doesn't have the power to extinguish a fire like that unless its a health and safety risk, or directed to by SAPOL.

By the way, not all alarms will be charged, the officer has to give a code to resolve this, as some might be genuine.

[uniden]

The `clean air act` that I stated actually is in the local council bylaws relating to allowed burning hours and conditions.

[SA Firey]

By the way, not all alarms will be charged, the officer has to give a code to resolve this, as some might be genuine.
[/quote]

Genuine no charge, otherwise YES

[bittenyakka]

and who gets the cash? SAFECOM or the brigade who spends half of there time at that place?

[backburn]

I was told that is only for the MFS. CFS will still not charge is this correct?

[uniden]

Can we keep this on topic. How about a new topic for alarm charging? moderator??

[Firefrog]

Agree! please keep it on topic if you want to discuss charging for calls create a new thread....Thanks

[mack]

I recently attended an incident where CFS and MFS were in attendance at a rubbish fire. The call was made by the local council inspector as some people were burning a large pile of tree branches out of hours. The particular council only allows burning this time of year between 10 and 3 mon-saturday. This particular burn was conducted on a Sunday, therefore illegal.
Upon arrival the CFS and MFS crews were subject to a tirade of abusive language from clearly intoxicated people. These people although were breaking the law were unhappy that the crews were about to start putting water on the fire. As a further fire appliance arrived the people settled down a little.

I realise that it is an offence for members of the public to hinder fire crews from performing their duties, but is it an offence to verbally accost them? Police were not called to this incident, but should have been. Any thoughts?

considering the fire service had no right to  extinguish the fire, going by the situation you have described, im not surprised they were unhappy. o/s of the FDS we have no power to extinguish any form of controlled fire (that is not a risk to life/property) without the owners consent or at the direction of a council officer on scene or SAPol officer...


 

remember, the Fire and Emergency Services Act is only enforced during the FDS

Police were not called to this incident, but should have been. Any thoughts?

per SOP - the Comcen that does the turnout should respond SAPol to any report of fire

[CFS_Firey]

remember, the Fire and Emergency Services Act is only enforced during the FDS

You mean the illegal burning part of the act?  I'm pretty sure we're allowed to save life and property all year 'round...

[mack]

I'm pretty sure we're allowed to save life and property all year 'round...

nah, its outside the FDS, im gonna let your house burn down... stuff ya.


(should have been more specific when i was saying bout the Act & Powers)

[Crank]

If the brigades were acting under the direction of the council officer then they have done the right thing.  They have reported it to the Fire Service so obviously its under their direction that they want it extinguished.

[Pipster]

If the brigades were acting under the direction of the council officer then they have done the right thing.  They have reported it to the Fire Service so obviously its under their direction that they want it extinguished.

But, as I mentioned before, if the fire service is acting under the direction of the Council Inspector, then they are using the Council Inspectors powers, which is OK.  However, if the Council Inspector just did a drive by, did not tell the occupants of the house that the COUNCIL INSPECTOR required them to extinguish the fire, and just sent the fire service, I think the occupants of the house were within their rights to tell the fire service to get off / keep off the property (although abusing them for it is a bit rough)

The CFS has the power to extinguish a fire on private property at any time of the year (not just fire danger season) if in the opinion of the CFS,  that fire is either out of control, or is likely to get out of control, then we can put it out, whether the occupant likes it or not.

A small rubbish fire, may not fall into that category......

Pip